This Week in Google 702, Transcript

Please be advised this transcript is AI-generated and may not be word for word. Time codes refer to the approximate times in the ad-supported version of the show.

Leo Laporte (00:00:00):
It's time for TWiG This Week in Google. Stacey, Jeff, Ant, they're all here. We'll talk about the, you know, dueling AIs. Microsoft announced it's gonna put AI into Bing. Google says we're putting Bard into Google's search. Ant Pruit says, why? We'll, we'll try to figure that all out. We'll also talk about some changes at Google, including blurring adult images in your image. Search some problems at Twitter, but not for Elon. Good news for him in his latest trial. And a lot more including pigeons, AI generated music, and Ant Pruitt demonstrating the power of the squeeze. It's all coming up next on TWiG!

Narrator (00:00:50):
Podcasts you love,from people you trust. This is TWiT.

Leo Laporte (00:00:58):
This is TWiG This Week in Google. Episode 702 recorded Wednesday, February 8th, 2023. Lion Around

(00:01:09):
This Week in Google is brought to you by Melissa. Over 10,000 clients worldwide in industries like retail education, healthcare, insurance, finance, and government. Rely on Melissa for full spectrum data quality and ID verification software. Make sure your customer contact data is up to date. Get started today with 1000 records cleaned for free at melissa.com/TWiT and by Fastmail, reclaim your privacy, boost productivity, and make email yours with Fastmail. Try it free for 30 days at fastmail.com/TWiT. Fastmail's also giving TWiT listeners a 15% discount in the first year when you sign up today and by Eight Sleep good. Sleep is the ultimate game changer, and the Pod Cover is the ultimate sleep machine. Go to EightSleep.com/Twitter, check out the Pod Cover and save $150 a checkout Eight Sleep. Currently ships within the U.S., Canada, the UK select countries in the EU and Australia. It's time for TWiG This Week in Google. And we got a great panel here for you as always. Ant Pruitt is joining us from Hands-On Photography, our community manager at the Club TWiT Discord and proud Clemson hat head wearer.

Ant Pruitt (00:02:32):
Yes, I am folically challenged and it's cold in here and I'm the only one here and I refuse to turn on the heater in the house if I'm the only one who

Leo Laporte (00:02:38):
I now have total sympathy after shaving my head a few years ago, I realize. Yeah, the hair actually keeps you warm. It's like a hat. I'm always wearing a hat.

Ant Pruitt (00:02:46):
Makes a difference, sir. Yep. Glad to be here. Appreciate you having me each and every week.

Leo Laporte (00:02:50):
Jeff Jarvis is here. He's the Professor Leonard Tow Professor as it would be, as it as it should be. Professor of Journalistic Innovation at the Craig Newmark.

(00:03:02):
Newmark graduate School of Journalism at the City University of New York. We should get pigeons. Cooing

Jeff Jarvis (00:03:10):
Craig in honor of Craig. I think Pigeons guy. I think, you know, you can, a pigeon rescue place visited him. There's great pictures of Craig with pigeons on him. I think we should, you should have a, a pet pigeon on the show. Leo,

Leo Laporte (00:03:23):
A pet pigeon <laugh> on the show. I wouldn't mind Pigeon on a orange <laugh>. How about that? Ooh, wait a minute. Ooh, Craig might not appreciate that. Also with a Stacey Higginbotham from Staceyoniot.com Hello, Stacey with her Frida Kahlo robot shirt.

Jeff Jarvis (00:03:46):
That's right.

Leo Laporte (00:03:47):
Did the robots have unibrow? What makes them Frida Kahlo?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:03:50):
They, they just look Frida Kahlo-ey. They kind of, they don't have actually they don't have eyebrows. Maybe

Leo Laporte (00:03:55):
They're not eyebrows at all. <Laugh>.

Jeff Jarvis (00:03:57):
Yeah. Okay. I got nothing. They're just robots.

Leo Laporte (00:04:01):
Whatever floats your boat. You know what else is here? Because we wanted to talk about something that's just coming out on the Kickstarter. Our good friend Glenn Fleischman is here. Hello Glenn.

Glenn Fleishman (00:04:12):
Oh, ho Hoy. How are y'all?

Leo Laporte (00:04:14):
Oh, ho ho <laugh> you told us last time you were on about this book you've been working on with Marcin Wichary. Is that how you say his name?

Glenn Fleishman (00:04:21):
It's let me work on it. It's Marcin Wichary

(00:04:26):
He's originally from Poland. Yeah. He's lived in the United States for decades now.

Leo Laporte (00:04:30):
It's called, he's written his

Glenn Fleishman (00:04:31):
First book.

Leo Laporte (00:04:32):
Oh, Shift Happens. The book's not out. But you can get in on the Kickstarter, right?

Glenn Fleishman (00:04:38):
That's right. We launched yesterday, so I should point, he's the author of the book. I'm the editor and project manager and bottle washer and midwife of the thing. And so we've been planning for literally years, launched it yesterday and it is well over $400,000. What?

Leo Laporte (00:04:54):
And our Oh God. Then you don't need to be on anymore. Thank you very much.

(00:05:00):
Holy cow, man.

Glenn Fleishman (00:05:03):
Well, it's people like typewriters and keyboards. That's the

Jeff Jarvis (00:05:06):
We found, yeah. A two hour chat with Marcin yesterday. It was just great yesterday.

Leo Laporte (00:05:11):
Wonderful. Yeah. Oh, I missed it. I didn't know about it. So you are already, I mean, 282% funded. Yeah. So I guess

Glenn Fleishman (00:05:19):
One day in,

Leo Laporte (00:05:20):
But that, but, but you know what? No, now we're not doing it for money. We're doing it cuz we know you would be interested in this. You our listeners, a history of listeners, keyboards from early typewriters to modern mechanical Marvels. It's gonna, it's beautiful production. It's slip covered two volumes is this four color. It's beautiful. Four color. Beautiful. It's

Jeff Jarvis (00:05:43):
Not only four color, but stochastic parrots or what is it? Like stochastic

Glenn Fleishman (00:05:47):
Parrots Stochastic screening. That's good though. I like mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. It's yeah, it uses a, it's a relatively So since like here I'll put up my printing history at, since the 1800s when methods were introduced into newspaper reproduction. The half tone screen has been the way that you take a continuous tone photograph and you turn it into collections of clusters, of dots that fool eyes into thinking their tones. Well, the new thing is Stochastic screening, which has been kicking around for a couple decades, but it's really been refined about 10 years ago. And it's like dithering, we all remember dithering from, you know, like mac paint art and so forth. It's like dithering, but it's like dithering times a thousand. So it's very, very fine clusters of dots. And you know, if you look at the so we printed, this is a press test that we made into a keepsake. We sent out to a few people like Jeff and Leo, maybe. And so there's pages like this that have what feels like a solid orange gradation. And it's all dots because Leo, look at really close

Leo Laporte (00:06:44):
With your eyes. I can't see You can't sees see the dots. No's

Glenn Fleishman (00:06:47):
Amazing. It's printing. Yeah. It's, is it like pointilism? It's a little bit like that. It's a little bit like that for sure. It's like little tiny shapes, but they're so small that you can't perceive them. So you get what looked like solid colors. So one of the things we're doing is there's like the footnotes and so forth. There's tiny orange footnotes. And normally you'd use a spot color. You'd have to use its own ink. And we're using the process colors. Cyan, magenta, yellow is how you print. And plus black is how you print for full color in most cases. And you separate out color images into those colors and you get the result. So this is, I don't know, it's an amazing little process.

Leo Laporte (00:07:20):
It's so beautiful. Here's some images. It really is that you sent us as part of the press kit so that people can see. I mean, this is going to be it's a, it's, it's something you're gonna wanna put on your shelf or your coffee, your coffee table. Yeah. Except it's, yes. Yeah, it's, it's,

Glenn Fleishman (00:07:38):
It's small though. It's it's a, it's a, what we're calling, it's like an, it's a like a coffee table book, but it's, how big is my head? It's like seven by 10 ish size. Nice. Seven ish by 10 ish instead of but it's gonna weigh like four pounds of 12, 4, 3 and a half pounds volume. We try to get it down, but yeah, volume one, it's, so it's two volumes. Volume one is kind of analog keyboards as like typewriter keyboards from their start. And what's, and then volume two is more digital. It's like keyboards attached to digital things all the way through mobile. But what the book is really about is about the stories of people. So it's technology told through a human lens as opposed to here's the model and long lists. And so you find out what an absolutely cranky person Christopher Shoals was, who is mostly responsible for the first typewriter that went into production, the Sholes and Gliden, it's usually called. That guy could not stop. He was never satisfied, could not stop inventing. He just kept tinkering at the thing. And even when he and Gliden managed to sell it to Remington, which put it into production in the 1880s, Sholes is like, ah, I'm not satisfied. He just kept working on the thing until his death. This kept making new models and prototypes and insisted it get better. Everyone else like is like QWERTY is fine for us. We'll just use QWERTy for the next 150 years. That's all right. You know,

Leo Laporte (00:08:52):
Here's Schul Sholes fancied himself,

Jeff Jarvis (00:08:54):
Kind of the rescuer women by creating Yes. And there's, I have this great print in my computer of, of wo angels and Sholes of him thinking that he, he rescued women from drudgery work to work in offices with drudgery work.

Leo Laporte (00:09:09):
Yes. Oh, but now they're typing instead.

Jeff Jarvis (00:09:11):
Exactly. Exactly. Okay. I would rather type something than run laundry through a mango. I

Leo Laporte (00:09:16):
Be honest. I agree. <Laugh> here is actually a collection of six keyboards that Stacey has pounded on <laugh> <laugh>

Glenn Fleishman (00:09:24):
Look

Jeff Jarvis (00:09:24):
Just like my keyboard. You're right. This

Glenn Fleishman (00:09:27):
Is what happens.

Leo Laporte (00:09:28):
<Laugh>.

(00:09:30):
This is an example of different kinds of switches, computer keyboards use. You know, you tapped into something, if you'll forgive the pun, because Oh, that's terrible. <Laugh>. Because there, there's something about computer folks and I, I think I'm kind of among the group where we're just really fascinated by keyboards. We, we buy expensive keyboards. A a broad variety of them. This is just ver so he's been wor he was a design, he is a design manager at Figma. So he is been a designer at Medium and Google and so forth. But obviously he's been collecting these images and these, this information for many, many years.

Glenn Fleishman (00:10:07):
Yeah. This goes back, he somebody Annie Beo, who's one of the it is the first CTO at Kickstarter and runs the xo XO conference and waxy.org, waxy

Leo Laporte (00:10:15):
Links,

Glenn Fleishman (00:10:16):
Generally interesting and lovely fella. Andy posted a message on Mastadon saying, pointing out to Marcin, that he'd started in 2015 when he posted a tweet that said, I should write a book about, and had a bunch of pictures. And Martine did not remember that. He thought he'd started a year later, but he literally said, I should write a book about it. So that's the left hand tweet and the right hand tweet is, and now it's on Kickstarter and it's funded. Nice. So it's pretty exciting. I mean, I have my stake in this. I really want this to be good, but it's lovely to support an author like this is his project and I'm so, you know, delighted to help bring it to fruition. But, you know, I, I've got a background in, in printing and, and a bit of fast typer since I was 11. I taught myself to type because my dad said, you know, typing might be useful. And I saw

Leo Laporte (00:11:00):
It. Yeah, that was right. Well, you're the perfect person to edit this. It will be released in October of this year. If you want the book, it's $125 or more for the early days

Jeff Jarvis (00:11:12):
Now. Only, only until only until when.

Glenn Fleishman (00:11:15):
Yeah. more 9:00 AM on February 9th. Don't pass that unless you're watching live.

Leo Laporte (00:11:20):
Don't, don't delay. It is, it's two volume 1,216 page hardcover book inside a custom slip case. Yes. It will be more expensive if you don't rush to Kickstarter and search for Shift Happens. Congratulations though. 2,500 backers.

Glenn Fleishman (00:11:39):
Thank you. Oh, we just hit the number this second. Thank you very much.

Leo Laporte (00:11:43):
Yeah. Really good news, Glenn. Thank you for coming on. I just wanted everybody to know about this and give 'em a chance to get in on the early bird show, Glenn, before it was too late. It's, it ends The early bird ends tomorrow. Yeah,

Glenn Fleishman (00:11:55):
Tomorrow. Yeah,

Jeff Jarvis (00:11:55):
It ends. So those of you watching the show next week use a way back machine or watch live in the week. That's right.

Leo Laporte (00:12:01):
<Laugh> from now on. <Laugh>, you must watch live. And you have till March 9th to get in on the Kickstarter. That's right. Fully funded. Good news.

Glenn Fleishman (00:12:10):
Wild

Leo Laporte (00:12:11):
Do if you do you have stretch goals if you get past the base mount is there.

Glenn Fleishman (00:12:16):
We have some, we have some ones we're hinting at. You know, it's funny cuz Kickstarter technically doesn't they don't encourage or discourage stretch goals. This is, this is the biggest Kickstarter, Kickstarter I've been involved with personally. But I've done a bunch of campaigns and it's interesting to figure out what motivates, you know, it's kind of like the unseen hand of the market plus the amount of of love and respect you've established among people turned into a, like a gumball machine. And you're like, all right, I've put it all in there. How many people are gonna turn the knob and gumballs come out? And so we set, we had some loose ones. We actually are gonna add a third volume that's gonna include kind of a little bit outta the books. Made the printed form of the index. So this will have a 1200 page book. We squeezed everything we could into the two volumes. The index was sort of going to be maybe digital only, but now the point it is, we'll print the index in the third volume that'll also go in the slipcast.

Jeff Jarvis (00:13:07):
So don't, don't print up the profits, keep the profits going.

Glenn Fleishman (00:13:09):
No, no. This all, we all very carefully. Carefully.

Jeff Jarvis (00:13:11):
So, so glad I I I, so the book I wanna write next, I'm writing a different book right now, but the book I really wanna know, write as you know, is, is the history of the Linotype. Yeah. And so you inspired me. I was thinking, well, what would it be? I mean, I'm not gonna mix something as, as, as as gorgeous and ornate as this. And I was trying to think about just the basic economics of a book. If you sold a book for 20 bucks, not 125 bucks with print costs and such, what's a, what's a critical mass look like for a lower priced thing on Kickstarter, efi?

Glenn Fleishman (00:13:46):
Well, it's interesting cuz you could I mean, you know, this is something I could unfortunately go on for several hours bat and I promise not to. But it's really economics winds up is being kind of shipping and binding. So if you're willing to ship only to the United States, it's very easy to ship and you can get a very predictable price. And the only tax you owe is typically in the state you're shipping from to people in the state you're shipping from with some exceptions, you know, but, but you don't, if you're shipping overseas we found I've shipped a lot of things overseas. I've done some projects that have shipped hundreds or thousands of items outside the United States. And those prices used to be more predictable. But now you have to pay excessive amounts of money. And then the people who get them may have to pay from 10 to, we heard 27.5% vat on the imported item that we can't really collect it ahead because we, there's, you know, 200 countries and we'd have to have arrangements with each of them.

(00:14:35):
So they have to pay the shipper. So the way to do a book really affordably is you, you settle probably on black and white or black plus one other color. You do a self cover or a, or not self cover other, but a, a soft cover book with perfect binding. So it's a glued on the side instead of sew, sew and you ship only to the us. And if you do all that, you know, you are reducing your worldwide audience. So you're reducing the scope of who you can sell to, but you reduce the complexity and you also open yourself up to hundreds of more printers who could handle it. So we, there's a very specialized group of printers in the US and more around the world who can do a hard cover, a hardbound book affordably in full color. And so that's kind of the secret is like US only perfect bound. So glued, binding soft cover. Yeah, but who

Leo Laporte (00:15:19):
Wants that? I want, so ins

Glenn Fleishman (00:15:21):
Well, that's the thing.

Leo Laporte (00:15:22):
I want a nice yeah, yeah, yeah.

Glenn Fleishman (00:15:25):
There's, I mean, that's the thing, right? So that's, I hate when book

Leo Laporte (00:15:28):
For the gust, you've opened a bunch pages start falling out cause the perfect binding glue releases and now you've got just a pile of paper.

Glenn Fleishman (00:15:36):
I don't, that's exactly it. I mean, the sew stuff for, you know, if you want a book that lasts I, I told Marchine and I believe it that I think this is the most exhaustive book. Clearly it's ever been written about keyboards. Oh yeah. It might be the, the most exhaustive ever because who would do this again? Right? The amount of effort someone else would have to say like, I'm gonna put, it's a contribution seven years of my life to write another thing like this. So Whyt, you already wrote it.

Leo Laporte (00:15:56):
What, okay, so before we let you go, what keyboard do you use? What's like

Glenn Fleishman (00:16:00):
Your favorite? I use the mattias quiet, I think it's called The Quiet Touch. And I think I go through this is no discredit to Mattias because I love their keyboards, but I type like a million, you know, I'm like Stacey, I'm sitting there going on my keyboard also a thousand key, you know, keystrokes submitted or whatever. And so I've gone through, I think I've owned six or seven Mattias, like the tactile pro, the quiet pro over since they started. So I used to love the apple that fantastic extended keyboard. And Mattias bought, as I recall, the key molds from the company so that they could make them. And their first, when they started making keyboards, they had to put an order in, I think for a million keycaps. And they managed before Kickstarter to get enough pre-orders to put the dye injection mold order in. And that's, I dunno, it's that 20 years ago now. So I just, I run through 'em when I say run through them every three to five years, I have destroyed the keyboard. My, my alien like acid of my fingertips has worn down all the keys and I gotta get a new one. And it's a great tax. It's like my $20 a year tax <laugh> to get a new keyboard every few

Leo Laporte (00:17:05):
Years. Wow. Taas was a sponsor for a long time. I have a lot of Oh, nice. Yeah. And I re I numbered their keyboards. And I love them all. I actually, we were talking before the show about quiet typing versus loud typing. And as much as I don't like the short travel keyboards for on air, I have to use them cuz they don't make any noise. But I love, I love I could make them make noise. Yes. <laugh> Yes you could. Stacey, yes, they

Glenn Fleishman (00:17:30):
Scream with

Leo Laporte (00:17:31):
Every touch. Got to this one cuz the FT is coming off now. And I, I suspect that Stacey did that. So I

Glenn Fleishman (00:17:37):
Tell a story about the do you remember Carrie Lou, who was a lovely technology writer wrote a lot of Mac stuff. He passed away. Yeah. Oh yeah. So Carrie, wonderful fell, lived up here in Seattle, died about 20 something years ago now. Carrie came into my office one day and he teased a keyboard in the garbage. And he said, why'd you throw that out? This is before electronics recycling. I'm sorry, this was 90 something, 96. And I said, the cue key stopped working. He said, why would you throw out a perfect good keyboard? Just put the cue on the clipboard and paste on the

Leo Laporte (00:18:03):
It you need

Glenn Fleishman (00:18:04):
And just paste it in whenever you need a cue. How often do you need a cue? And he took it and I'm sure he used it. Oh

Leo Laporte (00:18:10):
Wow.

Glenn Fleishman (00:18:11):
That's, isn't that the best? That's the perfect carry loose.

Leo Laporte (00:18:14):
All right. Actually everybody here except for you and me makes their living typing. Right? So I think that this, so how do you, what do you use Stacey? What do you bang on?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:18:26):
My, yeah, my bang, my banger is just this ancient microscope or Microsoft ergonomic keyboard. Oh

Leo Laporte (00:18:33):
Yeah. Those are good. I mean, actually,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:18:35):
Yeah, my, I mean, and then I, I wanna design, I have my little cherry kit to Oh yeah, pick my, but I can't tell which one. And then I get a little o c d about it and a little lot of anxiety. It's hard,

Leo Laporte (00:18:50):
Isn't it? Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:18:51):
Well, and the little key things, I, I gotta type my type, I gotta type on the whole thing. Yeah, yeah. I can't just type on like one key. That's not helpful. Yeah. Anyway, the good news is this Batia stuff,

Leo Laporte (00:19:02):
Like the people are really into it now. Cher's old hat. They're, there's, I know these key Kron and other, there's new companies doing key cat keys that switches and stuff. The Mattias Tactile Pro, I think you would like, are you using a max? Yeah. Okay,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:19:15):
Great. Yeah. And I need it, but I need it. Like I was looking at, they don't have an er, they have a split ergonomic, which I do.

Leo Laporte (00:19:21):
Oh. They do have an ergonomic effect. Like, you know what I will package up my ergonomic. I have it and I don't use it cuz it's too weird. I can't, but I will package it up and send it

Stacey Higginbotham (00:19:31):
Out. <Laugh>, are you gonna send me another e-reader?

Leo Laporte (00:19:33):
<Laugh>? This is, there might be a Cobo in it. I'm not saying there won't be

Glenn Fleishman (00:19:38):
<Laugh>. You got some pictures in the book of those, you know, the history of ergonomic keyboards? I used to use some split ones and then I, my hands change even though I had some real problems. And eventually when it sort of cleared up for between acupuncture and a bunch of other stuff, I went back to a normal keyboard and I've been able to use it. But I have the kind, you know, there's, there's ones that look like Globes. There's like the ones that you can rotate and split apart. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> angle at amazing stuff.

Leo Laporte (00:20:01):
I don't remember what kind I have, but it looks like this Stacey and I will, I will find

Stacey Higginbotham (00:20:07):
Yeah, the little split. You can, you know, if you hate them you can put them together, but it's

Leo Laporte (00:20:10):
No, it's like, it's so horrible. I will send it to you soon cause I, I will send it to you. I do this

Glenn Fleishman (00:20:15):
Can stage put together an ergonomics and

Leo Laporte (00:20:17):
Try to get attention for his keyboard. He's loving. Show us your keyboard Ant.

Ant Pruitt (00:20:20):
Mine is just the, I love this thing. Unfortunately the batteries getting weak, but this is the Logitech and it's keys.

Leo Laporte (00:20:26):
That's a great keyboard actually. So quiet. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:20:29):
Oh

Ant Pruitt (00:20:29):
No. Oh man, I, I

Stacey Higginbotham (00:20:30):
Got that and I had to give it to my kid. I

Leo Laporte (00:20:32):
Hated that keyboard. No, zero travel. It's like, oh. But I think the, I have the MX set and I like that a lot, but I think more and more of us, especially those who type a a lot are switching to those big mechanical, hard high travel. Right.

Ant Pruitt (00:20:46):
High. Yeah. See I just use mine for shortcuts in Photoshop. Tight room and premier and stuff. So

Leo Laporte (00:20:52):
How about you? So who, Jeff, what do you use to check?

Jeff Jarvis (00:20:55):
Oh, I just, my, my,

Leo Laporte (00:20:57):
You don't care

Jeff Jarvis (00:20:58):
What else? Yeah, he <laugh>

Stacey Higginbotham (00:21:03):
Like, no, I'm just like, oh, your poor little

Jeff Jarvis (00:21:05):
Hands. Really?

Glenn Fleishman (00:21:06):
He's like an atheist in the church. He's an atheist in the church of keyboard. What's

Jeff Jarvis (00:21:10):
On here? <Laugh>?

Leo Laporte (00:21:10):
Fuck. She is whatever. Who

Jeff Jarvis (00:21:12):
Here is a touch typist? Who? Heres a touch typist. Well,

Leo Laporte (00:21:15):
We know Glenn is,

Glenn Fleishman (00:21:16):
Yeah,

Jeff Jarvis (00:21:17):
That's all the two of us.

Glenn Fleishman (00:21:18):
40, 43. The

Jeff Jarvis (00:21:19):
Touch Stacey. Oh, okay. Well

Stacey Higginbotham (00:21:21):
You, I don't look at my, what does touch typing even mean? Do

Jeff Jarvis (00:21:24):
You use the, the right,

Leo Laporte (00:21:26):
The right letters? See, I'm

Stacey Higginbotham (00:21:28):
Too, oh no, I'm too sort of, I'm all the fingers and I don't look, I don't need to look at it. But I'm not a, like a by the book touch type.

Leo Laporte (00:21:37):
I think the question you have to ask nowadays is who's trained and who's not. Because we all, to some degree or other a touch typing cuz we just do it so much. But if you're trained and you know that you're the home row and you put your fingers in the right position and all that stuff. You

Ant Pruitt (00:21:50):
Threw her class. Yeah. You learned that I took class and had a a type and tutor on the computer at my

Leo Laporte (00:21:55):
Mava speak. Is it

Stacey Higginbotham (00:21:56):
Ma speaking? Mava

Glenn Fleishman (00:21:57):
Speaking. There's a chapter in Mava speaking in the book. There's a, is there chapter on touch typing? Yeah, absolutely not. You know, a she was a model from the original person was a model from do, she was from the Caribbean. Yeah, me telling me that. And she sort of disappeared. Like no one knows where she wound up. I mean, not like as insidious, but they know they lost track of her. But yeah, Mavis Beacon has been a terrific chapter on that. And there's also, touch typing was originally like witchcraft, like people didn't believe when typewriters, I mean, imagine if there was never a keyboard and then suddenly you have a keyboard and people are like, I can type without looking down. And people are like, what is wrong with you? That's not the right way to type. Can you look at the keys and look at them?

(00:22:36):
 All the, all the original typers you typed blind, so you actually didn't see what you typed the, the keys hit down below the, the platinum. So you were like the paper Up Up or sorry, up. Right. They were hit right onto the platinum, onto the paper. It was on the platinum. So you couldn't see until you were done typing what you typed. So people are like, you can't touch type, you'd be looking at your keys. It's very important. And there was also a theory that everyone would stop eventually making typos that you would, that typos were a problem of training, not being a human being. And I'm like, but what a wild thing. But when it was new, who knew? You're like, well, we'll all we'll be perfected. We'll perfect a teaching technique and then no one will ever type the wrong key again.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:23:17):
Huh. I failed to be, to even get into journalism school, to like take the fi the 1 0 1 classes. We had to take a typing test, which was

Jeff Jarvis (00:23:26):
Really,

Glenn Fleishman (00:23:26):
Oh man. Crazy.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:23:28):
This was, let's see, I went to my like 1996, so I'm like sitting there and I failed it twice before I managed to pass the typing test <laugh>. This explain a lot. It was the

Jeff Jarvis (00:23:38):
Journal about typing <laugh>

Glenn Fleishman (00:23:40):
Stacey.

Jeff Jarvis (00:23:41):
It was the hostility to the keyboard Exactly. That you've lived with ever

Leo Laporte (00:23:46):
<Laugh>. I get it now I get it. Glennn, thank you so much for coming by. Oh, such pleasure. Thank you everybody. You for Kickstarter shift? Yes. Happens. March Inari, w i c h a r r y. I think that'll be enough to Google it. Now's the time to get in before it goes up in price. I think this is gonna be great. Can't wait to see it. Thank you, Glenn. I appreciate it. Thank you. Thanks for having me on. Great to see you everybody. Glenn.Fun to Glenn Glenn. Fun. All right, let's take a break while we reset and get ready for the rest of This Week in Google with Stacey and Jeff and Ant, our show today brought to you by Melissa. Yes, that's a <laugh>. Fourth panelist is Melissa. Melissa, no, as a leading provider of global data quality, identity verification and address management solutions.

(00:24:37):
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(00:27:49):
If you're going to Miami in a couple of weeks, February 14th and 15th for the World Mail and Express America's conference, they will be there at stand number nine. Number nine, number nine. So go over and say hi to Melissa that's at the World Mail-in Express, W MX America's conference stand number nine on the Valentine's Day. Make sure you're give 'em a little blow, a little kiss. Make sure your customer contact data is up to date. Get started today with 1000 records clean for free. Melissa to the best. Melissa, m e l i s s a.com/twi TWiT. Lemme thank 'em so much for their longtime support of our shows. We support them. I'm really excited about all the great stuff they're doing. Go to melissa.com/TWiT to find out more and get those thousand records cleaned for free. Did you get up at five 30 this morning? I guess it wasn't five 30 for you, Jeff, but it was for me.

Jeff Jarvis (00:28:45):
I watched, I watched it. You did. I first suggested I, I a I stupidly sent an email to Leo and Jason saying, oh, you're gonna cover the Google search event. And then I saw what title it was and I said, no, Leo would be very grumpy.

Leo Laporte (00:28:56):
Very grumpy. So we are in a space race, baby. This is, this is like going to the moon. That's exciting. Microsoft well, Microsoft's partner open AI, and I can't even say they started it, you know, who really started it? Open AI put out Dolly two, their image generation engine. And then the folks at Stable Diffusion Runway said, hold my beer. And came out with Stable Diffusion, which was open source. You could run it on your own computer, generated amazing images. Along comes mid Journey and others, suddenly there's a just a huge barking

Jeff Jarvis (00:29:31):
Explosion. And Google barked a lot and said

Leo Laporte (00:29:34):
Huge explosion in image generated ai. Then open ai. Same people who did Dolly two came up, released chat, G P T. And that blew people's minds. And then Microsoft said, yeah, we did that <laugh>, Microsoft, one of many companies including Elon Musk, who put in money Microsoft put in a billion dollars to get open. AI started and announced last week, they're gonna put another 10 billion in and they're gonna start including chat G P T in their office. They had an event yesterday in which they announced they're gonna put chat G P T in their Bing search engine, which was an all hands alert for Google. Right? This is the one threat, this is the one thing that could topple Googles search, you know, Germany, some save. Well, Google's certainly worried about it. Every Microsoft has invited every influencer in. There's Joanna Stern from the Wall Street Journal. Somebody just sent me video from I Justine, who just by coincidence I guess was at the Microsoft campus <laugh> when Microsoft <laugh> just, just

Ant Pruitt (00:30:48):
By chance. I thought that was just around the corner from South, happened to be South la

Leo Laporte (00:30:51):
Yeah. Happened to be up there. And you know, she posted this on YouTube. I gotta say I don't see anywhere sponsored content or anything like that. I

Speaker 7 (00:31:02):
Am at Microsoft right now and they just announced something so incredible that's basically gonna change the way that we search the internet.

Leo Laporte (00:31:09):
So this is an ad not billed as an ad. And I don't know if she got paid or not. I doubt, I don't know. <Laugh>, I don't know. It's a little suspicious. Joanna Stern for the wall, at least Joanna was covering it for the Wall Street Journal. Right. but did a similarly, you know, this is gonna change everything. Interview with Satcha Nadela with

Speaker 8 (00:31:32):
AI is going to completely change what people can expect from search. We are grounded in the fact that,

Leo Laporte (00:31:38):
You know, so there's a lot of hype around this. Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (00:31:42):
Mr. Leport, this why is this is, are people so hyped up about AI in search because my little simpleton thought of me doing a quote unquote Google searches. I'm typing into a text field of something that I'm looking for and it's gonna return a list of stuff That's probably gonna be what I'm looking for within the first three or four entries usually. Right. what more do I need from that? Why do I need AI to step in and make this a better experience? Why should I get hyped up about this stuff?

Leo Laporte (00:32:16):
Stacey, Jeff, you wanna answer or should I,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:32:20):
Is that, is that a punch or is that a

Leo Laporte (00:32:22):
<Laugh>? No, I'm glad to do it, but I don't want dominate. Go ahead. I am, I am not. I have answers to you. I'm not a pun.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:32:31):
No, no. Cause my, my dog is making, hold on. I'm so sorry.

Leo Laporte (00:32:34):
No, go handle the dog. That's fine. You sec. No, I, I just, I'll tell you why

Ant Pruitt (00:32:37):
I these headlines and stuff and it, it seems really, really sensational, but I'm like, it's, it's search. What, what, what does the common person that's just looking for some information, will they get excited about this? Or why would they get excited about it? Well,

Leo Laporte (00:32:53):
Let me ask.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:32:53):
They will never

Leo Laporte (00:32:54):
Know. Let me ask <laugh>, my Neva my, the chat en engine, the search engine that I use,

Ant Pruitt (00:33:02):
Right? The private

Leo Laporte (00:33:03):
One, the, the, no, it's not private. You just pay five bucks one. Oh yeah. I guess if you have to pay for it. Although I think there's a free tier. But let me ask it. Why use AI in search? Maybe it will have an opinion it they've been doing before anybody else? Oh, we weren't able to generate an area. I summary for you because there are not enough pages or facts to answer it, by the way. That is No, you know what

Ant Pruitt (00:33:29):
That's doing. What it's supposed to do is looking

Leo Laporte (00:33:31):
Yeah, I like it. Let me search for something. Let's see. Is Clemson all that in college football? This is where you need a good football.

Ant Pruitt (00:33:46):
Just this one

Leo Laporte (00:33:47):
Weren't able to generate a summary cuz there aren't enough pages of facts

Ant Pruitt (00:33:51):
<Laugh> football.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:33:52):
Okay. So yours is not great, but the idea is you can have natural

Leo Laporte (00:33:56):
More. Who's the best in Okay. College football. Let me let, let me just ask you something. You, you can answer nothing.

Ant Pruitt (00:34:03):
I say Georgia,

Leo Laporte (00:34:04):
Nevermind. I'll give you rankings. Never.

Ant Pruitt (00:34:06):
Yeah, rankings.

Leo Laporte (00:34:07):
Okay. I, this is not a good answer. Obviously I was hoping the chat G p t could answer it for itself, but I think it's, here's the real advantage of it. And the reason I, by the way, I am now all in on ne Levi don't use Google anymore. Yes, you have to pay for it, but that means there's no ads. And I think the results are just as good as Google. And I like the ai. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Because here's why. Often now when you go to Google or anywhere you, you get a knowledge graph that shows you, you know, a piece of text that kind of answers your question. Google's always said people don't do search cuz they want to click a link to go to a website. They do search cuz they want the answer to a question. So why don't we just give 'em the answer and then we can put the Wall Street Journal outta business.

(00:34:50):
And this is kind of the idea is chat G T p G P T on Bing or whatever, nevas using, I don't think they're using chat G P T, but it's very similar. A conversational text chat engine is can, is one thing that's really good at is synthesizing information from a variety of sources. So if what you say is what I really want is the answer, not a link, you're gonna get links. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But what I want is the answer. Something that can go and look at three or four articles, synthesize it and create a short syop synopsis for you may well be exactly what you're looking for.

Ant Pruitt (00:35:24):
Case. So the idea of checking multiple sources. So the idea of checking multiple sources and, and trying to bring the, the giving summation to you

Stacey Higginbotham (00:35:33):
And giving you an answer. No, it's, it's, it's like, it's basically like if you asked me to explain something to you, like why does, why does this matter? And then I went to four different, or three different, or however many places I could find that talk about this topic. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, I, I come back and I say, Ant, this is important because it allows you to get multiple sources into one succinct answer, which is what most people want. Here. Let me,

Leo Laporte (00:35:58):
Lemme show you a good example. I wanted to know what is a cyclotron. So I said, how does a cyclotron work and the AI generated coming from Wikipedia, NASA by juice.com and vitu.com and it footnotes those it description of what a cyclotron does, how it works, what you get out of it. And this is the kind of thing if you asked a kid in eighth grade to write a paper, that's the paper, right? Yep. But if you're looking for me, it's

Jeff Jarvis (00:36:25):
Got all

Leo Laporte (00:36:25):
Siding there. Yeah. And it's cited and you can now still go to the links, right? And there's YouTube videos and all that stuff. But I like the idea that there often a quick answer, synopsizing a number of sources is really what you want from a search. And that's what I think these

Jeff Jarvis (00:36:40):
Guys are talking, which has media companies just, it's

Stacey Higginbotham (00:36:41):
Like basically like giving you Wikipedia.

Leo Laporte (00:36:43):
It's it's snippets on steroids because Yeah. You're not driving any traffic to the New York Times or the Wall Street Journal or anything else. No, no. You're just taking,

Jeff Jarvis (00:36:52):
And if you go to Bing.com right now, the promo box under the aspi, anything, we'll give you their example. Right? I need to throw a dinner party for six people who were a vegetarian can use just a three course menu with a chocolate dessert.

Leo Laporte (00:37:04):
Nobody's gonna take that in by the way. That's No, that's,

Jeff Jarvis (00:37:07):
That's right. Right.

Leo Laporte (00:37:09):
Normal people aren't searching

Jeff Jarvis (00:37:10):
For that

Stacey Higginbotham (00:37:11):
<Laugh>. Okay. But here's what, here's what we talked about. We actually talked about this in our show. There's company called Josh Do AI that does its own custom voice engine for smart home use cases. Imagine asking your smart home or your digital assistant, hey mm-hmm <affirmative>, give me a three-course meal for vegetarians. And then, you know, send it to my phone or whatever. But it could actually do that. So mm-hmm. <Affirmative> what we doing

Jeff Jarvis (00:37:38):
Is more sense. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:37:40):
Yeah. Well it makes more sense to be able to ask it via voice. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, I guess I could tell you. But then you also want it to send it to some sort of display or keeper. I, I would like for that particular thing. And I, I would think most of 'em, cuz you're gonna get a more exhaustive answer, I would say,

Jeff Jarvis (00:37:59):
Leo, I I, I have a theory having watched the Google thing, which we're not on it yet. I, but Oh, there's no Leo Well's. Not tj. Stacey. I'll bet, I'll bet. You know, <laugh> what besides search is Amazon, by the way, way I, I just broke down the fourth wall. I wasn't supposed to tell you that I wasn't supposed to revealed, but we could see each other now. So I blew it. I'm not a good podcaster, it's all good, but I'm an honest man. I tell you when Leo has to go pee and you all know it and you can trust me for that, you can trust me more than chat G p t <laugh>. Alright. Right. Stacey that wasn't enough. Bing. besides the thing we saw in, here's your, here's your three-course dinner next to a bunch of listings, which I actually find more useful cause then I have more choice.

(00:38:47):
 It's choosing for me. I don't need to choose. For me in this case, I think it's kind of a dumb example. They also showed, and there's a clip up on, on the rundown that when you're reading a the example they gave was you're reading somebody's financial results and it's a 20 page annual report and you've got a little chat G p T button on the, on the browser, the exact browser. And you say summarize there this document. And so it, it does something to your browsing as you go. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So what I, what I'm curious for, since Leo actually read more about it than you or you have read more about it or, and has read more about it than I have, is what, besides the fancy new Wikipedia box, does chat G p D actually give Microsoft? Cause I think that a lot of this hype we're seeing in the media coverage is, oh my god, Google's doomed. Well, what I've seen so far are neat gimmicks. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:39:38):
No, but I don't

Jeff Jarvis (00:39:38):
Think are fundamentally,

Leo Laporte (00:39:39):
Google thinks it, Google does think it's a problem. I mean they're worried about it's why I'm

Jeff Jarvis (00:39:43):
Gonna, I'm gonna get to that and

Leo Laporte (00:39:44):
I agree.

Jeff Jarvis (00:39:44):
Yeah. But, but I'll tell you what, media problem,

Leo Laporte (00:39:47):
No problem. You want no Microsoft gets out of it. Just try to sign up for this <laugh> and it will tell you. Okay, well you gotta make edge your browser, your default browser on all the

Jeff Jarvis (00:39:58):
Platforms. Hello. Justice Department,

Leo Laporte (00:40:01):
<Laugh>. Yeah. I mean it's the worst. It's like a to blatant, first of all, edge is a a terrible browser because that is a bunch of additional stuff like coupons and it that it's just lad with ways for Microsoft to make money and spy on you. So,

Jeff Jarvis (00:40:16):
You know, you know Leo, I found when I went wandering down the Microsoft page, cause I never used Bing. I went wandering down the page where they have all the headlines. That's interesting. They clearly used third party data cuz they had things that I'd bought for Ikea and I never used the Microsoft product. Yeah. No way for them to know it. Yeah, Google would know it and I searched for it. Microsoft wouldn't. And then second is you click on a news story, it goes to a Microsoft U R url. Yeah. It doesn't go

Leo Laporte (00:40:39):
To news. No, no. Apple does the same thing. And in Apple News, you can't share an article. I hate Apple News. Write Apple. You have to share it. I'm Apple News.

Jeff Jarvis (00:40:47):
If Google did this stuff, they would get, they would get brought in quarter.

Leo Laporte (00:40:51):
Yeah. Admittedly. But all three companies are trying to disintermediate the original sources of the information. And this is the same complaint people have about stable diffusion stealing from artists. Because all of the stable diffusion stuff is, is rehashed existing art that it's scraped from the internet. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, they have the same complaints about chat G P T. It's scraping from every possible text source. I mean, I think if you're putting stuff on the internet, you're kind of saying, okay, it's out there. But you're not saying it's public domain and they're treating it like it's public domain. That's

Jeff Jarvis (00:41:21):
The Well or it's a whole different, different world. The copyright was made for a very different era.

Leo Laporte (00:41:26):
Yeah. And we all know that. Yeah. One of the reasons there's a limit on copyright term is because all creation stands on the shoulders of the people who went before Walt Disney an invent Snow white. The brothers Grim did, of course he tried to pull the ladder up after him. As soon as he did it. He said, well I, I copyrighted this. But the whole premise is eventually it goes in the public domain. This is what Larry Legs Lessig was really pushing with Creative Commons and becomes part of the next generation of generative creation. Yep. Nobody creates in a vacuum. Maybe we're gonna loosen copyright and say, well, you know, in order to promote this idea of artificial intelligence we are gonna allow people to, to it is transformative.

Jeff Jarvis (00:42:11):
Well, let's, let's not forget you cannot copyright information. You can only copyright the treatment of that information. And so it basically, so when a business Insider rewrites the Wall Street Journal, they can get away with that and they can do that because they are rewriting it. They're taking the base information. Can I give you my theory about, about Google versus Microsoft on this? Having watched the thing?

Leo Laporte (00:42:31):
Well let's, first let's talk. Yes, but wait, let's talk about, well, I'm

Jeff Jarvis (00:42:34):
Asking, that's

Leo Laporte (00:42:35):
Why I'm, we haven't done it. A democracy. We gotta do the second part of the story, which is what Google announced and then we can say what your theory is about it.

Jeff Jarvis (00:42:42):
Well, is there anything else from Microsoft you found game changing? Interesting, fascinating. Not

Leo Laporte (00:42:48):
Yet. I couldn't have seen it, but it's not out yet. Understand my only experiences with Neva, I think it is game changing. I do agree it's bad for all the people who created the original information cuz you're not gonna click links. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, this is worse than snippets. This is the answer to effort. To you. It is. Or if there's a potential rev share there. Well maybe there's a way around it that's maybe what's what we're,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:43:12):
But hold on. We can't trust everything that this gives us. And I think that's Yes, we need to talk about that. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> because like a financial statement, if you're gonna pull and call from that. Okay. and it's also old. It's 2021. So

Leo Laporte (00:43:28):
That's check when we at, that's all old. Okay. What you just said, that's the way the chat G D P T that came out as the test worked, that is not how it's gonna work for being

Stacey Higginbotham (00:43:39):
Okay.

Leo Laporte (00:43:39):
So Chad tell me t as designed was never designed to be factual. <Laugh>. Okay. <Laugh>. David said that up front. He said, look, it's gonna be wrong. We're not, it's not designed to be factual. That's what Steven Wolfrem said when he wrote his article is we should work with these guys cuz Wolf from Alpha is mathematically factual. That's our primary purpose, but it's not with chat. G p t. Maybe if we worked together, they would be better. But that's just, that's a, that's a setting. Similarly, the fact that they froze it at whatever it was a spring 2021, that's a setting. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> that's mostly about cost. They could do what Google does. They could be continuously spidering information and adding it to the database. It's just a matter of cost. I don't know. And they haven't said what the chat G p t used for Bing or Google's, what their bard is gonna do. But my guess is it will, it has to be, if it's a search result, it's gotta be up to the minute, be current. You can't search for something and say, well this, this is only good through April, 2021. That's useless. Yeah. So I don't think we should judge it by what Chad g t said,

Jeff Jarvis (00:44:39):
But, but Stacey's still right. Stacey's still right about the primary point here, which is again, everybody forgets the primary job is to predict the next word. Not to understand. Not to know what fact is not to deliver facts. It almost needs a separate process to fact check itself because all it's doing is predicting words. That's

Leo Laporte (00:44:59):
How well again, case is, that's how it was set up. That's the same thing. That's what open AI's demo was set up. That's not what this by the way, is gonna use chat G b T four. Right. The next one. Right, right. Or is it three? I can't, anyway, I've lost track of four. Four is an

Jeff Jarvis (00:45:13):
Four. Four is the next one.

Leo Laporte (00:45:14):
There's nothing to say that chat g p t four cannot be biased towards fact dualism now. Yes. We should plan out that Google in its demonstration saying, yeah, we got that. Oops. Made a mistake like the first.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:45:28):
Yeah. So Google announced Bard. We should tell people what to

Leo Laporte (00:45:32):
Take. Yeah. So we had talked about apprentice bard last week as the thing. Google was, we, you know, every company including Facebook has said, oh no, we got that. It's really interesting what happened. Which is I think essentially chat G P T, everybody else was doing this in secret, including by the way I might add China. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> but chat G p T and open AI decided let's, let's just <laugh> just release the public, see what happens. And I think they had a good point, which was we can't go to the next stage unless we get a lot more input from the people. That's part of it. Same reason Elon Musk puts full self-driving out to the public, even though it's not really ready, it would

Jeff Jarvis (00:46:10):
Kill a few people. Well yeah, but we learn things.

Leo Laporte (00:46:12):
That's how, I mean, at some point you gotta do that. So you

Stacey Higginbotham (00:46:16):
Don't have to kill people. To be clear,

Jeff Jarvis (00:46:18):
I don't have to kill people

Leo Laporte (00:46:19):
<Laugh>. No, but

Stacey Higginbotham (00:46:20):
You know, I, I just thank you Elon

Jeff Jarvis (00:46:22):
<Laugh>. I I agree

Leo Laporte (00:46:23):
With the premise that you do have to fail.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:46:26):
You do, yes. You do have to fail.

Leo Laporte (00:46:27):
And at least in cars, unlike Chad, g p t, if you fail, you kill somebody or you may Yeah. I mean, well no, see

Stacey Higginbotham (00:46:33):
That's

Leo Laporte (00:46:34):
Our argument in Phoenix.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:46:36):
We're saying that you shouldn't do that. That we should actually avoid loss of life as our failure mode. I agree.

Leo Laporte (00:46:42):
<Laugh>, what if that, what if you

Stacey Higginbotham (00:46:43):
Couldn't, we can have failure mode, but loss of life. It's not, your innovation is not worth loss of life in what if you situation.

Leo Laporte (00:46:50):
I agree. What if you couldn't?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:46:52):
Then you have to say self-driving cars is not worth killing people. And I think that's a fair, I mean we can make is killing people

Jeff Jarvis (00:46:58):
Worth it kills far fewer people. Stacey, I mean I agree with you. Well, which is devil's advocate. What

Stacey Higginbotham (00:47:03):
If Well, no. And that's what people say. Kill.

Jeff Jarvis (00:47:05):
But not as many.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:47:07):
If you kill 10 people to save millions, I'm not a, what is it? A trolley? Utilitarianism trolley. Yeah. I'm not, I'm not game for that Now,

Leo Laporte (00:47:17):
By

Stacey Higginbotham (00:47:17):
The way, if you kill a few people to,

Leo Laporte (00:47:20):
That's your personal opinion. But not everybody agrees with you on that.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:47:25):
Well, I know.

Jeff Jarvis (00:47:26):
Let her finish with the opinion

Stacey Higginbotham (00:47:28):
<Laugh>. In part of that's because with self-driving cars, the life-saving stuff isn't proven yet. And it's kind of a little farther out. I think the closer you are to immediate savings of lives, the more you can like, so if you were gonna kill people to develop a cancer vaccine, that's a little different depending on how many people you kill. Right. cuz that's a little bit more direct than saying, oh, if we have smarter self-driving cars, blah, blah, blah. So I mean, I I agree. These are super nuanced conversations. But

Leo Laporte (00:48:03):
Yeah, I mean you can, we kind of

Stacey Higginbotham (00:48:04):
Got off search.

Leo Laporte (00:48:04):
You can, you can, you can. Well, but it's all the same. It's like, I mean it's not killing people, babies.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:48:09):
It is not all the same. That's like tech essentialism right there. It's not all the same.

Leo Laporte (00:48:13):
<Laugh> you kill a few people, but just save millions is a good thing.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:48:19):
And what it does

Leo Laporte (00:48:19):
For the stock price. Stacey, come on. Tr I hate to, I hate to. Yeah. I hate to point out, but this is how human civilization works. A war happens because it kill and it's gonna kill people, but it's for a greater good. Right. This is, is it though? This is hum. Well, you know, I don't, yes, I'm a pacifist. I agree. <Laugh>, I think we, we,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:48:41):
It depends on your

Leo Laporte (00:48:41):
War. I think if we hadn't fought the revolution, king George would've given up eventually anyway. So we could have saved some lives. Canada's nice. I'd like to be more Canadian. Nothing wrong with Canada's nice <laugh>. I mean that. But this is hu this is the story of human civilization. You can't, you can't deny that is we've always, you know medical trials, people die. Clinical trials people die. I know if

Stacey Higginbotham (00:49:04):
We don't wrong, but that again is, that is a different gradation that is closer to like immediately saving people having a medical trial that actually does something. Although I would argue you would have to have certain efficacy rates to like test that out. But just to say, I mean because self-driving vehicles, are we talking about self-driving vehicles or are we talking about like,

Leo Laporte (00:49:29):
Well, we're just talking in general just, but if you had a

Stacey Higginbotham (00:49:34):
Search term that like, I don't think risking someone's lifers, like let's say you were like, here's a great cake recipe, let's make it with bleach. And that was what

Leo Laporte (00:49:42):
Was

Stacey Higginbotham (00:49:43):
Up be in

Leo Laporte (00:49:43):
Your search term. That would be bad. But the good news is that

Stacey Higginbotham (00:49:46):
Is not worth the loss of life for

Leo Laporte (00:49:49):
Having die would never do that again.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:49:52):
Okay. We know already that we never should do that

Leo Laporte (00:49:55):
<Laugh>. That's a good point. I mean, but you could, can you stipulate that there are some things that you have to put this out in the public to find out if you can, if you can

Stacey Higginbotham (00:50:07):
Keep back, you're, you're also assuming we can put it out into the public without any sort of guardrails, like without thinking for a hot second. Like, oh wait, how could this be used to like really injure or harm people? And then try to predict what those are in guard against them. Well,

Leo Laporte (00:50:23):
I do, I

Stacey Higginbotham (00:50:23):
Just, that would be the responsible thing

Leo Laporte (00:50:24):
To do. Open AI did as opposed to, because you can't, can't go into a chat g p t and say, build me a Molotov cocktail. On the other hand, they didn't think people were as wily as they were. And they learned from doing that. That there are ways to trick chat G P T and telling 'em how to build a Molo

Stacey Higginbotham (00:50:39):
Top. Well, yes. Cocktail. And, and they'll figure that out. That is fine. I mean, that is what people do. We are, I mean that's, that's like hacking, right,

Leo Laporte (00:50:47):
Hacking. It's hard to predict how awful humans can be <laugh>. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:50:52):
Well people can also trick

Ant Pruitt (00:50:53):
It for good, include the net, the

Leo Laporte (00:50:56):
Platform. There's a long history of connect of both Microsoft and Meta putting out AI bots that immediately went bad, right? Yeah. Yeah. And I mean this is a, this is not new, but it seems to open AI's contention is, well we have to at some point, and I think they're probably right. You can't develop this stuff in secret forever at some point. Well, I mean, what's the point if you never put it out?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:51:22):
Right. But they did it, right. They thought about malicious use cases and tried to predict and put those guardrails in. That's, that's what Bing gonna do. They'll

Leo Laporte (00:51:31):
Continue and that's what Bing's gonna

Stacey Higginbotham (00:51:32):
And monitor for it. And

Leo Laporte (00:51:33):
That's what presumably Google's gonna do. Well. Yeah, we'll judge them. So the, there's two questions. First of all, is it worth it to do this? That was an's question. And are you satisfied that there are some value in doing it? This, doing this?

Ant Pruitt (00:51:46):
I got nothing out of it yet. Okay. it, it still just seems like a a, a pretty shiny layer. Yep. On, on, on text or, or information that we need. I agree with you. We're still going to end up just probably clicking through to a, a story or a link hopefully versus just going off of that. I

Stacey Higginbotham (00:52:05):
Don't think you will an depends on link. I mean, for certain things like you're

Ant Pruitt (00:52:09):
Researching it's new. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:52:11):
But like, I think more and more often, like which president was assassinated in his bathtub. I, I actually don't know. But <laugh>,

Leo Laporte (00:52:20):
None of them. There

Stacey Higginbotham (00:52:21):
Might have been any

Ant Pruitt (00:52:22):
<Laugh>. None. I don't think <laugh>,

Leo Laporte (00:52:24):
Which president was assassinated. No,

Ant Pruitt (00:52:26):
I think, I think there will be, you know, some use for it. But the way this isn't, this is, has been sensationalized. I think it's just a little over hype in my opinion.

Leo Laporte (00:52:35):
Here's an example I asked, is it better to turn off my computer at night? Is a question we get a lot. And there are links to a bunch of, there's a guy named Leo. Should I ask leo.com? <Laugh>? Not me. Not related. But anyway, there are a lot of answers to that. But look at the, so, so Ant you said, well, I would end up clicking on none of these, but look at the answer that the AI from Neva gave me. Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (00:53:00):
That's, that's, that's legit.

Leo Laporte (00:53:02):
And it kind of is the answer, right? You don't need to go any farther than that. It gives you three different sources.

Ant Pruitt (00:53:08):
Yeah. That's legit.

Leo Laporte (00:53:10):
So I think at this point you've got, this is what you wanted all along.

Ant Pruitt (00:53:14):
Okay. Yeah. That's legit. That, that answers my question.

Leo Laporte (00:53:17):
Okay. So, so that's question one is, is there a reason, is there a benefit to doing this? And I think we can agree there's some, there's potentially some benefits to doing, there's potential Yeah. The next overplayed media right now. But keep going. Yeah. The, the next question is, should we do it, given that sometimes it'll be wrong or there'll be problems with it. Is it worth doing it? Should we be doing it now, Stacey? Should we be doing it now or should we wait?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:53:43):
We should be, I mean, yes, we should be doing this now. I think when you're doing it though, you need to say, Hey, this result was generated by AI or

Ant Pruitt (00:53:50):
Some type of however

Stacey Higginbotham (00:53:51):
You wanna do it. But yeah. And, and this is a good use case for it and hopefully there is. The other thing I would say you should have in something like this is a, a feedback form that's really accessible for like you just told me to make a cake with bleach kind of situations or Right, right. This is like, cuz I think one of the things we miss a lot with deploying AI is having the ability to easily give feedback that's listened to and acted upon pretty quickly to fix things that are biased or just absolutely wrong. Right. Do all of these security. You shouldn't have to be a famous person on Twitter to get attention to a problem.

Ant Pruitt (00:54:33):
Yeah. Do all of these security cameras that have AI that just says, all right, this is a person approaching, this is an animal approaching and you send us, do they actually take in the feedback within the apps that people submit, say, no, you got this wrong. Or, or is that just

Stacey Higginbotham (00:54:49):
Some of them? Do some of them let you to tell them? Some of them don't. It really

Leo Laporte (00:54:53):
Depends. Here's, here's what Neva does. I'm sorry I keep Guz Neva except that they beat everybody to the punch. Nobody, you know, they're not a big name, but they beat everybody the punch they have ready.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:55:03):
You're giving them all the credit.

Ant Pruitt (00:55:04):
Not yet.

Leo Laporte (00:55:05):
They know we're at the top. It says, is this useful? So you have immediate a place you can immediately give them feedback. Right? Nice. They have a share button too, which is kind of interesting.

Ant Pruitt (00:55:15):
That's another

Leo Laporte (00:55:15):
Metric. How do I tie a slip knot to tie a slip knot? Take a bite of rope and wrap the tag end around the bite once or twice. Hold the loop. Pull the end. It's a tighten. What's a bite? What's, what's a bite? I don't know. That's the next question. Pulled that from a bunch of five different websites, including Wikipedia, 101 Knots Wiki, how net knots, animated knots. And then it gives you the, what you would expect, which is the videos and all that stuff.

Ant Pruitt (00:55:39):
I, I do like the idea that it says, you know what, this, these are a bunch of different sources because I hate that a lot of people depend on one source for all of their information. Yeah. Which in a solid

Stacey Higginbotham (00:55:50):
Choice, look at. And this way you don't have to click through three links,

Leo Laporte (00:55:52):
Right? Yeah. And then, by the way, so here's the, is this useful? And then you have a thumbs up. Yes. It's great. No, I'd like to report a problem. Let's report a problem. Now's light clear. Yes. Stale, outdated information. Incorrect answer mixes up people not, not comprehensive, nonsensical or other. I like this. Yeah, yeah. Nice. How do we tell, recommend I don't what a

Stacey Higginbotham (00:56:13):
Bite is. So I think I can put that in here. It should also have a, did they have a, this is harmful or this is offensive, or this is

Leo Laporte (00:56:21):
Yeah, they should, they don't, they have other, which you could then say offensive. 

Stacey Higginbotham (00:56:27):
Like, I feel like you need a, you need a, like a super like alert category, right? Like

Leo Laporte (00:56:33):
Yeah, that's true. Like, so we don't know

Stacey Higginbotham (00:56:34):
What a bite is. That's not a

Leo Laporte (00:56:35):
Problem. Whoop, whoop, whoop. They also have, remove one of the cited sources, which is interesting. Like, that source wasn't a good source. He should, that's good.

Jeff Jarvis (00:56:42):
That's good.

Leo Laporte (00:56:43):
Like it, this is how you develop this. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> and I, and, and you know, there's a lot of problems with it. Neva sometimes says I can't, or my servers are over, you know, burdened and so forth. It's just a little company. Oh, I hate, I should

Stacey Higginbotham (00:56:57):
Scooter tell is telling us what a bite is. It's a fold in the rope. Or you safe, she you shaped section of rope being used and making it up.

Leo Laporte (00:57:06):
There you go. Good. So are

Jeff Jarvis (00:57:08):
We gonna get to Google?

Leo Laporte (00:57:09):
Google's ai chat bot, they announced Bard, which we had mentioned was Orig was last week. Last week. The Google said to everybody all hands on deck use Bard. We gotta a apprentice Bard. We gotta see, we gotta get this up to speed. So they tested it internally. And now as of five 30 this morning Google says, we're gonna put Bard in. Did they say when they're gonna put it in their 

Jeff Jarvis (00:57:36):
No, they said that they are. Well, it was, it was fascinating cause I watched the whole thing. They said what's, what's his name? Kar came out and by the way, made, made a mistake himself. He said that the, today was the 25th anniversary of Google search. No. This year is not delayed into the area to correct himself. It was, it was issued. Facts are

Leo Laporte (00:57:55):
Hard. Let's put it, let's,

Jeff Jarvis (00:57:56):
Well then, and then they, they got ready for the, the, the live demo with the phone. And the phone was missing gone.

Leo Laporte (00:58:02):
It was gone.

Jeff Jarvis (00:58:03):
It was gone. It, he's gone. Somebody, they had to use a search engine to find it. Yeah. Somebody's gone. France, you know, I don't know. They

Leo Laporte (00:58:09):
Found, didn't think of it. They find my phone and they found it.

Jeff Jarvis (00:58:12):
No, they, it was gone. It was gone. <Laugh>. So

Leo Laporte (00:58:15):
Wow.

Jeff Jarvis (00:58:16):
So, and they made the mistake.

Leo Laporte (00:58:18):
This, this tells you that this was rushed. That they were freaking out and they said Microsoft announced, yes, we

Jeff Jarvis (00:58:25):
Gotta, well, because of the, I think it's mainly pressing my, my point later will be about marketing. But let's get to the details of what they said. So they said that the interesting thing was they kept pressing again and again and again. It was interesting how we are doing this safely.

Leo Laporte (00:58:38):
Ah,

Jeff Jarvis (00:58:38):
Chat PD could go rushing out there cuz it's just chat. Bt Facebook and Google have been doing both tons of AI work. But they, they're scared to death because every little mistake as we see today is gonna get blown up. And so they kept on talking about how we're doing this safely. We have trusted people judging this. We're gonna put it out in the right way. We're gonna put out their time, no promise of time, but we're gonna have this really neat thing that's gonna do all kinds of stuff. And then they went on, it was almost like an IO thing where they went on with other things that they're doing that are neat. Some of this is in the change log and elsewhere enhancements to translation, enhancements to maps multimodal search more things with lens. So they try to do a comprehensive and, and they said proper car said, you know search is still our number one.

(00:59:28):
Moonshots search won't always change, but the moon, the moon moves, he said, and, and it'll always change. And so they had a, a large io like list of all the things we're doing. Well, I'll make my point now real quickly, which is Google I think is far way ahead of Microsoft and ai. Microsoft had to go use chat. G P T Google does have all kinds of neat things, but it's a marketing problem to grading extent. Cause I don't think to use Lens. I don't, I'm not gonna think to use multimodal search. I'm not gonna recognize the, the trans translation is 10% better. They have all this work and all this wonderful stuff. It's a much more nuanced story. But they don't know how to tell the, tell the story at all. Microsoft comes out and says, look at this shiny toy we just added to our old Buick. Isn't that cool? Everybody says, yeah, nice paint job of that old Buick. Can I take a spin? Yeah, great. And that's kind of where it is now. Google has, you know, this monster thing, huge thing. And Microsoft has a Buick with a new paint job.

Leo Laporte (01:00:28):
Here's the reason that this is an issue. Yeah. Because for all of the great stuff Google does with Translate, that's ai. Right. you know, with Lens, that's ai. The, the one thing that makes Google money is ads on search, search, search, search. And if, and a Buick comes along and steals the money maker, doesn't matter what you got and translate in lens. Right. And so they're

Jeff Jarvis (01:00:54):
Threatened. You can have a self-driving car or cab and, and, and yeah. It's an

Leo Laporte (01:01:01):
Existential threat to Google.

Jeff Jarvis (01:01:03):
Well, this is where I'm gonna, I'm gonna disagree a little bit because I think that the media hype has been ridiculous today. Cuz they're dying. They're dying to say Google's doomed. And you know what little I can play with the Jack G p D stuff, the demos and that kind of stuff. Oh, oh, okay. But and you know, I, and I tweeted today, I'm old enough to remember when Dolly was changing all of our lives. And I haven't heard Dolly, he talked about in quite a while. And, and I think that there's this rush. It's part of what Anne's saying. There's this kind of rush to the shiny thing in media and the desire for Google to be vulnerable. Cause it's a good story if it is true. Well, yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:01:42):
That's how we get people read our stuff.

Jeff Jarvis (01:01:45):
I know this is not, that's what's wrong with media. And everybody blames the internet for that and we invented it.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:01:52):
Okay. That's not true. So, oh, like, yeah, we did this before the internet.

Jeff Jarvis (01:01:56):
Yeah, yeah. That's saying definitely. Yeah. We invented sensationalism and the attention.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:02:00):
Well, and that's, that's because that's what people read.

Jeff Jarvis (01:02:04):
Yeah. It's what they're, it's what we've fed them. It's what we trained them to read. And

Stacey Higginbotham (01:02:07):
It's, well, but see, if you have like Joan Blow who's sitting there, who cares about his life and like the Super Bowl or whatever he cares about. If you wanna make him care about something else, you have to make it exciting. Right. So basically we're just trying to push something that people don't really care about and make it exciting.

Jeff Jarvis (01:02:28):
That's i's gonna say, no, you're insulting me and that's why I don't like you news people. Right. Ant <laugh>.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:02:33):
No, I'm not trying to insult. I'm just saying like, Ant probably like, okay, I know you ca like Ant cares about photography and Google and anything he's doing for his job, so he'll click on this. But like, if you don't care about that, you've gotta really make an effort. So maybe Ant doesn't care so much about fashion, but if someone, you know, does something,

Ant Pruitt (01:02:52):
I'm, I'm the weird one in this group cuz even with some, some of the photography related news is out there, there are some things I will refuse to click on because they will sensationalize the headline and say something

Stacey Higginbotham (01:03:05):
Totally out.

Ant Pruitt (01:03:06):
They, they have to. I'm like, that's you're just wrong things. You haven't earned my click on that.

Leo Laporte (01:03:10):
An is the, is the demographic I'm

Jeff Jarvis (01:03:13):
My team. An

Leo Laporte (01:03:13):
An is the demographic that drives advertisers and creators Crazy <laugh>. Yeah. Because I,

Ant Pruitt (01:03:20):
I don't wanna look on YouTube with the thumbnails and you making the weird faces and I'm, I refuse to

Leo Laporte (01:03:25):
Click on We can't reach you media. We can't reach you <laugh>. It's driving us crazy. <Laugh>, we can't answer to read this. We can't. I think to some degree, Stacey, it's, it's to get people to read something they're not interested in. But also to some degree it's trying to write stuff for the things people are interested in. Right. If you found out everybody wants to know more about Pez dispensers, you'd do more articles about Pez dispensers.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:03:48):
Well, yes, yes. That is a hundred percent true. But I I I think originally it's really just a desire to, to find the narrative that gets people to read the story. Especially cuz if even originally at your most noble self, right? You're trying to get people to care about something you care about and how are you gonna get them to

Leo Laporte (01:04:06):
Care about that might be where you went wrong. And what you should really just do is write about the things people care about you as dumb as they might be. And stop trying to No, no, but your attention is stuff they should, that you want them to care about. <Laugh>

Jeff Jarvis (01:04:18):
Stacey, I'm in the, in bottom of my,

Leo Laporte (01:04:21):
Nobody cares about city council meetings. Just give up <laugh>.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:04:25):
But they should care about it cause it matters to their lives.

Leo Laporte (01:04:29):
No, but as a baby, fall out of a three story window. Now tell me about that.

Jeff Jarvis (01:04:34):
So that, that comes from the telegraph. That comes from mass media. That's an invention. No, that's huge. Later in life. No, no, no, no. Well that's, yeah. There's witchcraft and all that before

Leo Laporte (01:04:43):
No humans care

Jeff Jarvis (01:04:44):
About, look, I thought we had some standards. I I I'm at the, I'm at the auto of my career folks and I'm ashamed of my business. I'm ashamed of my

Leo Laporte (01:04:51):
Career. You shouldn't be because all

Jeff Jarvis (01:04:53):
I am

Leo Laporte (01:04:54):
All this comes from the original, from gossip originally from what people talked about over the backyard fence. And that's the thing people care about. And it's embarrassing because we don't really care about the city council meeting or what Joe Biden said at the State of the Union yesterday. We care about, oh, did you hear that? The Tasty freezed it, the down at the corner went out of business.

Jeff Jarvis (01:05:17):
That what do they, but the media we care about there everything that the internet is accused of, media invented, the attention economy, sensationalism trying to manipulate people's emotions, trying to addict them, all of that. That's just a, starts with media. That's a different, the internet is, is in a temporary phase of trying to copy

Leo Laporte (01:05:37):
That. I'm gonna defend media. I think they're just trying to co meet people where they're at and Yeah. And, and we care about celebrities. That's how we are. Okay. That's how we are.

Jeff Jarvis (01:05:46):
They're trying to make money. They're everything you accused of algorithms of doing is what media people do. And they're, and the algorithms are just trying to copy what media people have taught them to do all these years, which wasn't always the case. Yes. There was witchcraft in early printing. Yes. Early printing caused all of that. It's in my book coming out in June. Which, look at me, I'm trying to

Leo Laporte (01:06:08):
Tell you something. Isn't it possible to interpret it your way that it's malicious and my way that they're just trying to meet people where they're at?

Jeff Jarvis (01:06:15):
There's a middle way, which is to say what's the, what's the motive that's involved? And if it's informing people, if it's entertaining people, entertainment is a fine thing.

Leo Laporte (01:06:24):
Well, you'd be dumb to, but, but,

Jeff Jarvis (01:06:25):
But watch a

Leo Laporte (01:06:25):
Newspaper that nobody wanted to read.

Jeff Jarvis (01:06:28):
If it's to do what you just said a minute ago about Google and ads and all that, that's exactly the, the problem is we're in an early phase here of the internet where it is adopted, the business models that were known in media. That's why people think it's media. And I think we've gotta break free of that. But if I, and so, so there's two, the worst of media is now on the internet.

Leo Laporte (01:06:47):
There's two reasons I might choose what I wanted to do a podcast about. One cuz I care a lot about it and mm-hmm. <Affirmative> and I'm just gonna do it cuz I, that's what I like to talk about, which is, by the way, how I do it or the other is to, is to do something that serves your audience, that your audience is interested in. There

Jeff Jarvis (01:07:07):
Can, there not be, there's

Leo Laporte (01:07:08):
Anything wrong intersection. I think there's anything intersection. Well, you're lucky if you thing you care a lot about. It turns out the thing I cared a lot about some people, not a lot, not the vast majority, we're not producing content that, you know, competes with TMZ by any means. Right.

Jeff Jarvis (01:07:23):
This is not Good Morning America.

Leo Laporte (01:07:24):
This is not <laugh> and it never will be. And, and I don't even

Jeff Jarvis (01:07:28):
Feel Good Night America,

Leo Laporte (01:07:29):
But I don't feel any pressure to make it more like T mz. Yo, what did Bill Ga, who did Bill Gates sleep with last night? I don't think we need to do that. But I happen to be interested in technology and there's a certain amount, there's enough people who're interested in that, that our content is of interest to them and we can make a living. I don't think that's been

Jeff Jarvis (01:07:47):
Serious. Yeah. I'm not saying serious all corrupt, but I'm saying that the corrupt, I'm saying that the corruption to the internet is accused of are are corruptions that came from media, mass

Leo Laporte (01:07:56):
Media, the internet. No, I am the internet. I think the vast majority of the internet is people like, is like us. People write a blog about something. They're just, it's it's Glenn Fleischman doing a book about keyboards.

Jeff Jarvis (01:08:08):
Yeah. Yeah. I I think this is our escape hatch. I agree. I agree. The internet is our escape hatch from those corrupted media models.

Ant Pruitt (01:08:15):
But

Leo Laporte (01:08:15):
I, you know, I, I sat newspapers and is our antidote because an isn't gonna look at that crap, says screw you all Ant's gonna read the article that's about a camera that doesn't have sensationalism in it doesn't have some guy going, whoa, it's gonna be about the camera.

Ant Pruitt (01:08:31):
If the headline says, new camera announced from manufacturer so and so, I'll click, okay, what did they announce?

Leo Laporte (01:08:39):
You're the antidote <laugh>, you're how it should be. And an would you rather go to the Nike site or the story about Nike?

Ant Pruitt (01:08:49):
I'd rather go to the Nike site because Nike is the source.

Leo Laporte (01:08:52):
That's key too. Ah, yep. But what if <laugh> Uhhuh, this search engine gave you the information you were looking for. There were full circle. There we

Ant Pruitt (01:09:01):
Are. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>

Leo Laporte (01:09:03):
Again, you

Ant Pruitt (01:09:04):
Go started at the beginning of this. If I'm searching for something, more than likely I'm looking for the link to who? Whomever I'm talking about. If I'm searching for Nike, I'm looking for that first R URL to say nike.com/topic. Have you, you know,

Leo Laporte (01:09:19):
Is Ant Short

Ant Pruitt (01:09:20):
Granted, but that's, but that's me though.

Leo Laporte (01:09:22):
<Laugh>. Well, but no, I'm saying you're the right, you're, you got it. The right, you got it right. And I bet you a lot of people are like you. I know. I'm like you. I, as soon as I see a YouTube thumbnails somebody going, Hey, you won't believe what happened next. If I see an article that says you won't believe I won't read it, I won't

Ant Pruitt (01:09:37):
Yeah. Scroll right past.

Leo Laporte (01:09:38):
And I think that partly that's because you and I have been burned so many times, we're now rebelling. Right. We also know how the sausage is made. Yeah. Because we're in the sausage factory. No, we aren't. I am the internet <laugh>,

Ant Pruitt (01:09:51):
You know, I looked at, there was a video from, and I put it in Discord in the channel there Jared Poland, who I love great photographer in Philadelphia area, big YouTuber. I've always watched him because he, he pretty much tell it like it is and, you know, don't really hold back and he has good information. And there was a recent video that talked about shame on Adobe, yada, yada yada. Because at the time there was a news story about Adobe allegedly just stealing your images and your information to feed into its ai. Right. And when that happened, I was like, this is bunk. Because I remember personally, I remember when my Adobe Creative Cloud, creative Cloud went through his update. They give you a, a screen of what's, what's being affected when you do this update, this is what's gonna happen. And in that screen it mentioned feeding the AI and how you can just opt out.

Leo Laporte (01:10:51):
Oh, so they said front. Yeah, yeah.

Ant Pruitt (01:10:53):
I did this story came out. And I'm like, what? So I went and looked at mine and I had already opted out. Why? Because this was months ago.

Leo Laporte (01:11:02):
Right.

Ant Pruitt (01:11:03):
<Laugh>, when they were released.

Leo Laporte (01:11:05):
Okay. I think in that case it might be a little cynical on that YouTuber's part because he kind of knew that Well no, I think,

Ant Pruitt (01:11:10):
Well it was everybody talking about it. It <laugh>. He wasn't the only one. It was a hot story at the time and I didn't, I

Stacey Higginbotham (01:11:16):
Didn't watch it. Yeah. I think sometimes people notice like, I mean we see this all the time in the smart home where like, I'm like, holy cow, look you can do this. And then, you know, I'll write about it cuz I found it helpful or useful. I'm not trying to tell people this brand new. I'm just like, Hey, this just happened. Like Kevin just did his hearing aids with his iPod, second generation pro, whatever they are. And people loved that. It's been out for months. Many people knew about it. We weren't saying it's new, but people learn something. So I don't always think

Ant Pruitt (01:11:48):
That's, that's not what happened with this story. Miss Stacey, what happened with this story is people were saying shame on you, Adobe.

Leo Laporte (01:11:55):
Yeah. They're stirring up outrage

Ant Pruitt (01:11:56):
When the Adobe was straight up saying, look, this is what the update's going to do. You can opt out right here. And of course I did. And I don't know if everybody else did, but I did. So I didn't think anything about it.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:12:09):
Hey,

Leo Laporte (01:12:10):
I think Jeff is finally coming around to what I've been saying all along about Google, which was that if Google had just <laugh>, if Google had just stuck to their knitting and given us search results, instead of buying all these companies and doing all these recommendations, they would be in a, in a cleaner position. But really what it is now, it's all about link bait marketing. And well,

Jeff Jarvis (01:12:30):
I'm, I'm gonna agree in a way, one of the people on Mass don, where the discussion is much better than Twitter. And, and we get

Leo Laporte (01:12:35):
To that. Well, today you couldn't even tweet. Did you see that? Yeah,

Jeff Jarvis (01:12:38):
I couldn't, well I can again <laugh> So, but, but ma ma mask is gonna limit it. But we'll get to that later, after, after the next commercial. So somebody said to me on Mask Dawn today, well the problem is that, that part of my point was that Microsoft can show me it's shiny chrome Google, I have to ask for it. I have to say, oh, there's this thing called lens, I have to know to use it and so on and so forth. But then somebody came in and said well, you know, the problem is that Google's saying we have all this technology and how can we make you use it? Which is the same problem with media, right? I have this newspaper, how can I make you buy it? Rather than going back and saying, what do people need? And I remember way back in the day, Marissa Meyer at Davos when I talked about hyper-local.

(01:13:22):
And she said, no, no, it's gonna be hyper personal. And she was right. She was, you know, the idea was Google knows you well enough. Now, of course, now that's scary. That's creepy. That's data That's awful. Cuz Google blew it and the whole industry blew it. And in, in scaring people off letting media scare people. But that's where it should have been going, is that Google is truly your assistant. That's why they used that word. And they didn't really fulfill on that promise. So you and I are also agreeing that, that the, I mean, and the way I'm sad about one 20 closing, but I think your point is right, that that was stuff that was off focus, right? So what should their focus be in terms of service?

Leo Laporte (01:13:58):
Well, Larry Page said it when he started, when he started Google, he said, any, we can never take advertising because that will pollute our results. They knew it, but they said we have

Jeff Jarvis (01:14:08):
To, but there's no other way to support it.

Leo Laporte (01:14:09):
There's no other way to do it. Or for whatever reason they, they,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:14:12):
Well, wall Street. Wall Street,

Leo Laporte (01:14:14):
Yeah. Yeah. Lot of that. You could blame Wall Street. I mean this nevas interesting because they know they have to pay for it. It's not cheap. So they say, we're gonna charge you five bucks a month. Is it worth it to you not to have ads? And to have kind of search results? Right.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:14:28):
So I think this is an underreported story, which is the idea that we are in the middle of a transition where we're gonna start paying for things that we once associated with being free. Free. Because we value our data soon. Even if you think about chat G P T and things like that, possibly accuracy and like, and

Leo Laporte (01:14:49):
Privacy.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:14:49):
More and more people and privacy and so, but privilege

Jeff Jarvis (01:14:53):
Rears its head here

Stacey Higginbotham (01:14:55):
And well, yeah,

Leo Laporte (01:14:56):
Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (01:14:57):
But disinformation misinformation will be free stuff shouldn't be and will be abundant. Look,

Leo Laporte (01:15:01):
Stuff wasn't free. I mean, stuff always.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:15:04):
And you still had to buy a paper. Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (01:15:06):
Whatever the reality is gonna be that conspiracy theorists will get everything that they want in life for free. People who want quality news and information will pay. And, and we're gonna face the fact of what that does for

Leo Laporte (01:15:19):
Market. This notion that stuff

Jeff Jarvis (01:15:20):
Should I don't care about. Should

Leo Laporte (01:15:21):
I think this notion that stuff should be free came from the internet. I

Jeff Jarvis (01:15:24):
Didn't say should. I didn't say should. I just said that. It's, the reality is people expect it. Crap will be free and quality will be expensive and there's gonna be an impact. I don't on society from that,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:15:35):
So I don't know about that. So maybe on the internet you're paying for a couple things and getting quality content, but there's always gonna be aggregator type services that will be free and have an ad model. Kind of like TV

Leo Laporte (01:15:51):
News. I got a counter example. How about this counter example TV used to be free, it was ad supported free. You had three channels, you watch it. Yep. Whatever was on people now are willing, if she demonstrated and we do it, we pay more for content than ever before in history. Hundreds of dollars a year for every one of us. Very few people expect content to be free. We all, Netflix, we all, we're all paying for something. That's the counter. There are a lot of OT people out there. There are, but they're a man. They're a minority. Maybe they're the conspiracy theory, not John's jobs. I don't know. But I I think that's a good example of what Stacey's saying, which is we're gonna realize there's value in some of this stuff and we're gonna pay for it because it's better that way. And I think that's happened with television. Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (01:16:38):
I I, I I think you're right. But all I'm and, and I'm dying for pay for algorithms and filters for social, I'm dying for pay, for recommendation engines. I think we're gonna end up there. I Sorry. I agree, Stacey, but I'm also saying it's very Stacey like I'm me to say, let's think about the implications of the reality here and in a world. And I, and truth isn't dead and I, and I, I don't believe all that, but for some people there will be an endless supply of crap and conspiracies. And we've got a societal problem about how, what do we do? And putting the good stuff behind the paywall cuz we get away from the advertising and it's corruptions. I is gonna have a second order effect. That's all.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:17:23):
So I will say one of the problems we had with like the, the crap and conspiracy theorists is that we had officials who were in power endorse those for their own gain. So it wasn't just a fact that it was happening, it was happening. And then people who were legit were like, yes, it is a hundred percent true that there are children in the basement of this pizza parlor that people are taking blood from for youth or whatever. So when a senator tells you that and goes on and they let that person on TV to talk about that, they've got both the credibility of their profession, but then they've also got the credibility of a news channel that is cynically pandering to people. Yes.

Jeff Jarvis (01:18:08):
Yes. Again, media. So again, media,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:18:10):
Yeah. But the only reason that person is not all media on tv,

Jeff Jarvis (01:18:16):
That media

Stacey Higginbotham (01:18:17):
Well, but the only reason that person is on TV is because of their profession. Cuz they made it out to whatever profession they were. So, I I mean, social media is a tool, but it's our inherent cynicism and love of power that's really causing us the most problems.

Jeff Jarvis (01:18:33):
Right. By which real issue here. You're right Stacey. And, and, and so many of the problems that we attribute to and blame on technology or media are simply soci. This is part of what Leo's saying too, are society's problems are hu human problems. And, and, and we've gotta separate them out and realize that because trying to think that the technology's gonna solve it when it didn't cause it is gonna get us very far.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:18:54):
Right. And that's where, that's where we are. Like even trying to regulate hard things like privacy or how many people we should kill with self-driving cars. We seem to think that technology can solve this problem. Right? But it's really up to us to make an ethical immoral stand.

Jeff Jarvis (01:19:08):
Yes. Agreed.

Leo Laporte (01:19:10):
Now I will tell you something that maybe you get for free, you probably do get for free that you really should be paying for. And that's our sponsor Fast man. Woo. I mean, honestly, this is true. I've been saying this for a long time. We, yeah, you can get free email, but you, what do you, what does it cost you to get free Email costs you your privacy. It costs you finding quality, it costs you service. That might be the most important one. Support you have a problem with free email. Good luck finding somebody to fix it. And if they cancel your account, good luck finding somebody to turn it back on. That's why years ago I shifted to Fastmail and I have never been happier Fastmail as little as three bucks a month. But boy, it's good email. See, the thing is free email's not free.

(01:19:56):
You pay for it with your privacy, with lack of support for a variety of things for over 20 years. Fastmail has been a leader in email privacy at Fastmail your data, yours with better productivity features for as little as $3 a month, no ads. Your personal data is safe, it's GDPR compliant. Fastmail stores your data in the us and when you need support, you're talking to a real email expert in the US who puts you first because you are the customer, not the product. I am a huge fan of Fastmail. Let me just run through some of the many, many reasons I use Fastmail. First of all, it's real email. They use an IMAP server called Cyrus, which is open source. They contribute back to that open source project. They also have features like siv, which is an amazing email tool for filtering.

(01:20:51):
They have an automation system that lets you automatically write your SIV rules. But when you're in your Fastmail email and you see something and you go, oh, I wanna make a rule about that, it's as easy as just clicking that email and saying, Hey, I need a new rule. And suddenly your email is organized. It's done right. It's the way it should be. Fastmail works with any email client because it's true. Imap, even Gmail isn't real imap. They use some non IMAP features like tags. Fastmail gives you the best of both worlds. IMAP folders, Gmail style tags, and it works with Thunderbird and, and Firefox and, and Google Mail and email, whatever program you're using on Android or iOS or, or a Mac or Windows or Linux. It works, it works with all of them cuz it's imap it's standard email.

(01:21:40):
They even have a fabulous web interface, better than anybody's web interface plus apps on iOS and Android that let you customize your workflow with colors and custom swipes. They've got, sorry, Jeff, night mode or day mode, if you like, that you can send, you can snooze, you can use folders or labels. You can search bar, keep track of all the important details in your life. I like Fastmail so much. I recently moved my calendars from Google and my address book from Google to Fastmail cuz it supports true cald dev and WebDev and card dev. So it's tra it's it's absolutely standard. And now I sync up all my calendars with Fastmail my notes too. It works with password managers like our sponsor Bit warden and one password to make it easy for you to create unique passwords for every account, but also unique email addresses for every account, which makes it doubly safe. I love that. Plus there's the added benefit of, if, if a company you subscribe to sells your email address, you know exactly who did it <laugh> because they're the only ones with that address. I use, I use the domain manager to keep all my domains@fastmail.com, whether it's for websites or servers, my Minecraft server, because then all my emails handled properly using all the modern authentication techniques like d a C and dki.

(01:23:01):
S P F FastMail does it right? They practically invented this stuff. An advertiser's, sorry, but there's no room for you. Your privacy is at the center. People use Fastmail because look at just the reviews of people. And I'll put my name in there too because I've been using Fastmail for 10 years and I could not be happier. I just signed up for another three years. I do it three years at a time. Those annual prices save you some money. I've tried 'em all. Folks, this is the one. And don't worry about losing information. You can take your old email, move it over to Fastmail ca. You can even, and I have this, have your Gmail accounts active and just have it automatically forward to Fastmail. So you use all of the benefits of Fastmail, but you don't have to give up your old email address.

(01:23:46):
You can create custom addresses as many as you want. So I have, you know, I have a domain leoville.com, but anything sent to@leoville.com goes into my inbox. So I have as many email addresses I as I want and an infinite number. Fastmail's moving email forward with new internet standards and open source innovations that power other email services <laugh>. They're the leaders. They're the best. New Year, new you, new email. Look, I don't know how to convince you, but at least you can try it free for 30 days. Convince yourself, reclaim your privacy, boost productivity, make email yours with the best email service in the world. And I am not alone. Geeks agree Fastmail's the one Fastmail.com/TWiT. And because you're listening to this show, we're gonna give you a 15% discount in the first year if you sign up right now. But you have to use that address Fastmail.com/TWiT Fastmail.com/TWiT. It transformed my relationship with email. It's just the best fastmail.com/twi. I've been trying to get him to, to advertise in our shows for a decade. I'm just thrilled I can finally, I can finally get paid for the plugs I've been giving. I'm like crazy. Fastmail.Com/Twit. You know the name Brett Taylor?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:25:08):
Yes. I just saw the LinkedIn thing. Yeah. Is that what I'm talking about? Yep. What's he doing?

Leo Laporte (01:25:12):
C e o. Former co glue. Something new. Former co c e o of Salesforce.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:25:17):
And was also

Leo Laporte (01:25:19):
The creator of Twitter. Yeah. Chair of Twitter. Joey. He was the chairman of the board. That's right. That's right. And when he was at Google, did he create, what did he create? Was it Gmail or something? No, he's been there for a long

Stacey Higginbotham (01:25:32):
Time. He was Facebook is where I knew him. It was at Facebook. He was the what did he do at Facebook World?

Leo Laporte (01:25:38):
He had a startup called Quip. 

Stacey Higginbotham (01:25:41):
Sold to

Leo Laporte (01:25:42):
Salesforce. Sold to, that's how he got at Salesforce.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:25:44):
Oh, he was the former c t O at Facebook. Yeah, cto. That's right.

Leo Laporte (01:25:49):
He has paired up with a Googler, clay Bever, who was in fact the product manager for Gmail for a long time. Google Docs. He worked at Google for 18 years, ran augmented reality and virtual reality technology towards the end. So, gosh, you got, this is royalty, right? Oh,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:26:08):
He was the co-creator of Google Maps. Was the former CTO O at Facebook.

Jeff Jarvis (01:26:13):
Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:26:13):
Brett or Clay? Brett. Brett. Yeah. That's it. Google Maps.

Jeff Jarvis (01:26:17):
He was, he

Stacey Higginbotham (01:26:18):
Was also a founder of Friend Feeded

Leo Laporte (01:26:20):
Friend Feed. That's that's where I first

Jeff Jarvis (01:26:23):
Met Brett. Brett Brett's a really nice guy too. Love

Leo Laporte (01:26:25):
Brett. These Brett was one of the classiest guys in the business. And friend Feeded was amazing. That's how he got to Google. I did. Was it Google that bought Fred Feed? Yeah, yeah,

Jeff Jarvis (01:26:34):
Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:26:35):
Friend Feeded was the best social network bar none if that were still around anyway. So Brett, who,

Jeff Jarvis (01:26:44):
Oh

Stacey Higginbotham (01:26:44):
No, he found he was at Google first and then he founded Friend Feeded and he left to join first. That's how I got to Facebook.

Jeff Jarvis (01:26:50):
Baseball. Right. There we

Leo Laporte (01:26:51):
Go. Facebook we're terrible. Killed friend Feeded. Well, no, you know what, we've just been around a long time. And this is 15 years a tech history, right? This is,

Jeff Jarvis (01:27:00):
Yep.

Leo Laporte (01:27:01):
Yeah. So he and Clay have gotten together to launch an artificial intelligence startup.

Jeff Jarvis (01:27:10):
<Laugh>. Sorry. Because all the children gotta have, sorry, blockchain. Blockchain. We can make

Stacey Higginbotham (01:27:15):
Fun of it, but it's clearly sa it's basically what's happening with AI is like, it's going to underpin things like it's gonna become an infrastructure type of technology. Yeah. And being able to throw computing powder power at designing these algorithms and then scaling them out over different problem classes is gonna be like, it could be crop band or mobile service.

Leo Laporte (01:27:38):
Could Yeah, it could be. He's just gonna tell farmers when to plant crops. I mean, we don't know what he's gonna do with it. Ai

Jeff Jarvis (01:27:43):
Yeah. And something something related to business is what he's saying. That's all

Leo Laporte (01:27:45):
He's saying. He's not saying we're just getting started. But it's gonna be an AI That's smart. I mean, if I were a young man starting out in this world, I might look into AI as well. He's,

Jeff Jarvis (01:27:56):
He's somebody on one warfare.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:27:57):
He's 43

Leo Laporte (01:27:59):
<Laugh>. That's young to me.

Jeff Jarvis (01:28:00):
<Laugh>. <laugh>. Yep. That's, that's older

Stacey Higginbotham (01:28:03):
Or possibly 42.

Jeff Jarvis (01:28:04):
That's oldish. I know. I see these, I see

Leo Laporte (01:28:08):
These things about, oh, I'm 40 now and I go,

Jeff Jarvis (01:28:11):
God, that's like a kid that's like, right. Jeff <laugh>. That's so God. Yeah. Graham. Oh yeah. I would

Leo Laporte (01:28:17):
Love to be 40.

Jeff Jarvis (01:28:19):
Oh

Stacey Higginbotham (01:28:19):
High five Ant

Jeff Jarvis (01:28:20):
<Laugh>

Stacey Higginbotham (01:28:21):
Right here in the forties. Oh, whoops. This way. Forties

Jeff Jarvis (01:28:24):
Is the

Leo Laporte (01:28:24):
Best time man. You got the energy woman, you got the verve, you can still walk. Yep.

Jeff Jarvis (01:28:30):
Yep. Still obnoxious. Yep. Yep. Still walk, still obnoxious <laugh>. Yeah. You can go

Leo Laporte (01:28:37):
Out there and you could start a new AI startup.

Jeff Jarvis (01:28:41):
Yep.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:28:42):
Getting right on it.

Jeff Jarvis (01:28:44):
These

Leo Laporte (01:28:44):
Are, but I have to say anything that Clay and Brett do is gonna be something. I mean, these two are really smart. A lot. I have to say though, a lot of times these old guys who had great successes in their twenties and thirties don't do so well in their forties. I'm just saying. Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (01:29:02):
But he started enough stuff. He's like, Eve Williams what Eve kind of Yeah, but he started stuff.

Leo Laporte (01:29:07):
A lot of stuff. Yeah. Serial entrepreneur and all that. Yeah. He's certainly got the credentials. I mean, that's a hell of a resume. Nothing more to say except that that's what they're doing. We don't know what And we don't know when I was

Stacey Higginbotham (01:29:17):
Like, oh, do you know more? But no. Apparently you do not. I

Leo Laporte (01:29:20):
Read the Wall Street Journal just like everybody else.

Jeff Jarvis (01:29:24):
You know what, you know what we need,

Leo Laporte (01:29:25):
Leo? What do we need?

Jeff Jarvis (01:29:26):
We need audio. We did a, a clip, a soundboard of Stacey typing. So when we have breaking news <laugh>, it's like, it's like

Leo Laporte (01:29:34):
<Laugh>. Oh man. It's, you know, that's already Stacey available. Somebody has already done that. I'm like, go ahead, everybody be quiet for a bit and Stacey's gonna type it. We're gonna, we're gonna record this and use it.

Speaker 9 (01:29:54):
Ouch.

Leo Laporte (01:29:55):
<Laugh>. Okay. Zoom in center. Enhance. Okay, now we have it. We will make that our new bumper. Maybe. Maybe breaking news. Anthony. Anthony Nielsen's. So good. He's gonna add a little and we're gonna have it. It'll be breaking news. It's good. He is so good. Ladies

Jeff Jarvis (01:30:13):
And gentlemen, all the at sea we have Breaking

Leo Laporte (01:30:15):
News's. 

Jeff Jarvis (01:30:18):
Actually my breaking news.

Leo Laporte (01:30:21):
That

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:21):
Was real.

Leo Laporte (01:30:22):
Oh, there's real breaking news. Play the sound effects. Oh, we don't have 'em yet. <Laugh>.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:29):
I was gonna say, do you need me to type again? Go on. Yes,

Jeff Jarvis (01:30:32):
Yes. Again.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:33):
Oh my gosh, it's so fake now.

Leo Laporte (01:30:43):
Oh, I love jammer. B

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:45):
<Laugh>. I will say, so you know what my, my typing thing is, any child of eighties will appreciate this. It's, it's the beginning lyrics for, it's the end of the world as we know it. It's

Leo Laporte (01:30:54):
The end of the as we know it.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:58):
So like, that's great. It starts with an earthquake. Type it along. <Laugh>.

Leo Laporte (01:31:01):
That's the rhythm. Or are you actually typing those words?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:31:06):
Those are the words I'm typing

Leo Laporte (01:31:07):
All work. And no play makes Jacko if boy,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:31:11):
Because if you can keep up, you're feeling really on it, you know? Plus you've got the kind of like verb happening there. <Laugh>. Nevermind

Leo Laporte (01:31:17):
<Laugh>. And then we're gonna rip it out of the headlines <laugh> and give it to Jeff Jarvis for this breaking story.

Jeff Jarvis (01:31:30):
So I don't, so we were talking earlier about Twitter being down for a while and, and, and, and all of us were told, even though we tweeted not at all, that we tweeted too much Hollywood reporter says at the same time that Twitter is going to place limits on tweet frequency and followers.

Leo Laporte (01:31:45):
So this, oh,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:31:46):
I thought they just,

Leo Laporte (01:31:47):
Its spurious

Stacey Higginbotham (01:31:47):
Announcement. They were launching their blog post.

Leo Laporte (01:31:49):
It was a spurious announcement that said we tweeted too much and everybody God, including me and I haven't tweeted in months. <Laugh>. Yeah. But apparently this was a new thing that will limit users to a maximum. It's

Jeff Jarvis (01:31:59):
Unrelated, but related.

Leo Laporte (01:32:00):
Oh, but wait a minute. Listen to the maximum 2,400 tweets a day.

Jeff Jarvis (01:32:06):
Oh man, I gotta cut down. Geez.

Leo Laporte (01:32:08):
Who tweets You

Stacey Higginbotham (01:32:09):
Actually might

Leo Laporte (01:32:10):
A hundred, a hundred times an hour. <Laugh>, buts,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:32:14):
Bots.

Leo Laporte (01:32:15):
It's all about the bots, isn't it? It's

Jeff Jarvis (01:32:17):
All about the

Leo Laporte (01:32:18):
Bots we had on our Mastodon and I, I had a ban him eventually, but we had a guy who would post like 400 tech news, random tech news stories all at once. Geez. And it's like, I god shit. And I know most people can bl can block any, you know, you should know this on Mastodon. If you don't like it, you just block that person. You won't see their stuff anymore. Or you can cost you money

Jeff Jarvis (01:32:38):
All that.

Leo Laporte (01:32:39):
Well it's not even that. It's just that I can't block anybody cuz I have to wa I have to keep an eye on what's going on. So I had to see it No one else had dude, but it was enough for me. I went finally go get outta here. Go away kid. You bother me. Yeah,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:32:52):
Maybe, maybe this is Elon's way of monetizing like Chinese or Russian bot farms.

Jeff Jarvis (01:32:59):
It might be is also there's a maximum of 500 dms a day. A follow limit of 400 today.

Leo Laporte (01:33:04):
All of that is good. All of that is really good, frankly. Yeah, it's all bot stuff though.

Jeff Jarvis (01:33:09):
Yahoo's bot stuff.

Leo Laporte (01:33:10):
Here is some other news just came out, 3:43 PM We have been busy with some updates to the Twitter api. I, so you can continue to continue to build and innovate with us. We're excited to announce an extension of the current free Twitter API access. Wait a minute through February 13th. That's, yeah. You got five days. Wait a minute, what? And then, oh wait minute. There's a thread. Is that what that means, Jeff? That when they get the little, the Yes. The ball of twine. Yes. My son. What is, what is that mean? What is that and how do I do it now? Do I now that it's gone from Twitter to click the ball of twine, what do I do to get the thread <laugh>? How do I get the thread? You wanna spool it. How? Come on. Oh man. <Laugh>, just, just scroll. Scroll down. Scroll. There you go. What is this thing called Twitter? Paid basic access that offers low level of API usage and access to ads API a hundred dollars. Oh, forget about it. Geez, these bots, a lot of 'em are just some, some guy doing some fun stuff. You know, script kitties, right? Horse eBooks. Is it gonna pay a hundred bucks to tweet random nonsense?

Jeff Jarvis (01:34:14):
And researchers can't afford this.

Leo Laporte (01:34:16):
A new form of, wait a minute, wait a minute. Oh, wait a minute. Okay. A new form of free access will be introduced as this is extremely important to our ecosystem. Limited to tweet creation of up to 1500 tweets a month for a single authenticated user token, including login with Twitter. Oh, that's all right. 1500 b that's, what is that? 50 tweets a a day. That's probably enough. Right? Okay. All right. That's on February 13th. We will deprecate, not if

Stacey Higginbotham (01:34:41):
You're life blogging.

Leo Laporte (01:34:42):
Oh, good point. On February 13th, we'll deprecate the premium api. But you're not log blogging via api. You're actually tweeting, right? Aren't you?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:34:51):
Right.

Leo Laporte (01:34:51):
That is true. Yep. If you're subscribed to premium, you can apply for enterprise to continue using these endpoints. This is a new chapter for the Twitter API to increase quality reduced spam, which it will. Right. And enable a thriving ecosystem. We appreciate your patience as we implement these changes. I think a hundred bucks is a lot. But on the other hand, the free tier 1500 tweets a month, that's seems like would be more than adequate for the horse eBooks of the world. This is what Google unfortunately sent out. <Laugh>. It's an animated giff <laugh>. When they were talking about this thing, they a, they said, here's an example introducing Bard. Why, for instance, showed this question. What new discoveries from the James Webb telescope can we tell my nine year old about? But wait, but wait, one of them is wrong. J James Webb Telescope did not in fact discover any exoplanets that was done 15 years earlier by a professor who was a little annoyed. <Laugh> <laugh>.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:35:53):
I would like to be able to type, I mean, I already type these into Google. Like I often type in like, like I've got some coconut milk and some tomato paste. I'm like, coconut milk and tomato paste. What can I make uhhuh? And it will give me delightful recipes. Well, let me try some, which are like,

Leo Laporte (01:36:09):
So Google will do that. Or, or chat. T p t.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:36:12):
This is just straight up normal Google, but I'm wondering if it would be better with like an AI

Leo Laporte (01:36:18):
Tomato juice. And what is this real what? Gimme some real ingredients.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:36:22):
Tomato paste. And this was real tomato paste and coconut milk.

Leo Laporte (01:36:26):
Really?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:36:27):
I mean, I knew there were gonna be other ingredients I needed. I just was trying to use up some.

Leo Laporte (01:36:32):
Okay, let's see what Neva says. No, they got nothing. They just got a bunch of recipes. Legally healthy. That's what I want. Legally healthy blonde creamy tomato pasta with coconut milk. Oh,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:36:42):
See that would be perfect. How

Leo Laporte (01:36:43):
About a life changing 30 minute masala sauce. Life, life changing ants turned

Jeff Jarvis (01:36:48):
Off, says, no, it doesn't change my life. Stop doing that. Right? Ants,

Leo Laporte (01:36:52):
<Laugh>. How about a five ingredient vegan? Say word vegan vodka pasta or coconut chia pudding. And there's no tomato paste in coconut chia put. Yeah,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:37:01):
There's no, I would not put tomato paste, but like those are the kind of, I just, it said I saw the cue was what can I use, what can I make for lunch with the ingredients on my fridge? And I was like, oh, that's actually something I commonly type in

Leo Laporte (01:37:12):
<Laugh>. Okay. See, see? But don't ask it what James Webb telescopes up to. Cuz that's absolutely not no good.

Jeff Jarvis (01:37:19):
Yeah. So that, that one

Stacey Higginbotham (01:37:20):
Mistake today. Well, it's leaving me too. It's actually not serving me What it should. Cuz it's linking out to recipes, which is so, but if frankly they could just give me a

Leo Laporte (01:37:27):
Recipe. I know for the recipe sites it's better <laugh>, right? <Laugh>, you wanna, you wanna just steal that information without going there, right?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:37:36):
God recipe sites, they're like the

Leo Laporte (01:37:38):
Worst. I know, I know. You like epicures don't you? Some sites they do long articles. Oh, and then they put the recipe. Oh, look what they did. Six, six lines. Oh, look what they did. So, okay, so I clicked on the recipe. This is Neva for ComEd and it just gives me the recipe.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:37:56):
Oh, there,

Jeff Jarvis (01:37:58):
Okay.

Leo Laporte (01:37:59):
And I can even send this recipe to Stacey <laugh>.

Jeff Jarvis (01:38:03):
Oh, oh, okay. Oh, diva.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:38:05):
Oh wait, go back. Trouble with Turine. Wait, what did you ask it to do? Because it's giving me sun dried tomatoes. What can

Leo Laporte (01:38:11):
I make with tomato? Tomato paste. Paste and coconut milk it Act.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:38:14):
Yeah. Click that again cuz I don't think it was actually answering the bread correctly.

Leo Laporte (01:38:17):
Oh, it says sundried tomatoes. No. Tomato, tomato.

Jeff Jarvis (01:38:20):
Pasta.

Leo Laporte (01:38:21):
Paste. Paste. So that's not a good recipe.

Jeff Jarvis (01:38:25):
It,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:38:25):
It does not serve my needs.

Leo Laporte (01:38:27):
It's interesting. So it is extracting the recipe. Ooh, this is weird. Look at this. It's just the recipe.

Jeff Jarvis (01:38:34):
It's a no-no. Love

Leo Laporte (01:38:36):
It. Wow. That's not a snippet either.

Jeff Jarvis (01:38:38):
That's saying a nono Mr.

Leo Laporte (01:38:40):
Jarvis. Yeah. That's taking away traffic, isn't it? Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (01:38:43):
Mm-Hmm. But, but but however, however, for my days at a precarious, which Stacey doesn't like, I find out which

Stacey Higginbotham (01:38:50):
There recipes aren't very good.

Leo Laporte (01:38:52):
Look at this. Look at this. Look

Stacey Higginbotham (01:38:55):
This. They're super fancy and not as true, as tasty as they should be. That's true for the

Jeff Jarvis (01:38:58):
Effort. That's true. Look at, anyway, there's way whether or not you can copyright a recipe. Right? So that may be what they're hid. Look

Leo Laporte (01:39:03):
At how, look at how this is formatting. So that's ingredients. Then there's instructions. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, then there's review all of this without going to the site. But the, but I understand why cuz a lot of times sites will have 12 pages of article at the very

Jeff Jarvis (01:39:16):
Yeah. Go to the site now and see how badly it's presented at the site. I'll bet this is a major improvement.

Leo Laporte (01:39:20):
Yeah. See,

Jeff Jarvis (01:39:21):
See because we gotta go through the whole light. Okay. See you guys see perfect lead, right? See life changing. Lot

Leo Laporte (01:39:26):
Of big

Jeff Jarvis (01:39:26):
Pictures. Look at that awesome side lighting there on the, on this

Stacey Higginbotham (01:39:30):
Photos. Yeah. It's nice though. Photos. Good

Leo Laporte (01:39:32):
Photography. But I stole the recipe.

Jeff Jarvis (01:39:34):
Probably stolen. There's

Leo Laporte (01:39:35):
The recipe.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:39:36):
And this isn't actually bad. Oh, you've got an ad blocker. Cuz normally what happens is they use all this because they wanna have ads. Like this would be

Leo Laporte (01:39:42):
An ad, like, oh yeah, that's what it is. Sure. Sorry Lindsay, it's nice to meet you too. Former fourth grade teacher, Hersh, she and her husband Bjork live in Minnesota. And I feel bad because we've just stolen that recipe from you thanks to Neva. But I have to say my recipe manager paprika does the same thing. It has a built-in browser. I, I go to the site, I say download the recipe, format it and save it to my, save it to my recipe box and I'm gone. Wow. But at least they got a hit on the webpage. They got the full webpage loaded. Right.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:40:18):
Yay.

Leo Laporte (01:40:20):
<Laugh>. Interesting.

Jeff Jarvis (01:40:21):
Did you watch the hearings today?

Leo Laporte (01:40:25):
Who was hearing what?

Jeff Jarvis (01:40:26):
This was the Twitter watch, the state Roth and Vja got. And

Leo Laporte (01:40:32):
Tell us what happened.

Jeff Jarvis (01:40:33):
Fred Baker. So this was, this was the Hunter Biden laptop, Twitter, New York Post thing. Bless.

Leo Laporte (01:40:41):
And what court is this?

Jeff Jarvis (01:40:43):
This was, no, no, this is, this was congress. This is Jim Jordan. Oh.

Leo Laporte (01:40:47):
This is the

Jeff Jarvis (01:40:47):
First of their investigation.

Leo Laporte (01:40:51):
Is this the one where Paul Gosar started to go off on JS replacing us <laugh>?

Jeff Jarvis (01:40:57):
No, not, not that I don't think today. Okay. I just, if you go not line number 66 you could just pick a random odd video from it. Okay. Marjorie Taylor Green went wacko all kinds of accusing Yoel Roth of terrible things. Was

Leo Laporte (01:41:14):
She wearing that really good looking faux fur coat that she wore last night? That was right. That was attractive. And Kirsten Sinema looked like she was wearing the Chinese balloon.

Jeff Jarvis (01:41:24):
Yeah. Yeah. <Laugh>,

Leo Laporte (01:41:26):
Which is, you know, topical former Twitter executives former, by the way. Yes. testify on the hearing of the Hunter Biden laptop story. Yoel Roth. S So give us a summary, the kind of unbiased summary. Oh, I'm not

Jeff Jarvis (01:41:41):
Gonna be unbiased at all. The Republicans are out to make a lot of attention and go, they're going crazy trying to accuse Twitter of doing bad things, and the Democrats are making fun of them. And the poor Twitter people just had to suffer through the day.

Leo Laporte (01:41:55):
So, Twitter this is in weeks before the November, 2020 presidential election. They limited the spread of the post articles about the Hunter Biden laptop. 24 hours later, they did allow users to share links to the articles. The main New York Post account was suspended for two weeks for refusing to delete its initial tweets.

Jeff Jarvis (01:42:19):
Right? And Roth Y Ross said that he said at the time, that was a mistake. And then they came back. But it was the, at the time, it was the belief, it was the hacked information. Here's

Leo Laporte (01:42:28):
Follow looked. Here's the testimony.

Jeff Jarvis (01:42:30):
The hack of the D N

Leo Laporte (01:42:31):
C. Here's the testimony. Says the first glance, the story bore a lot of similarities to the 2016 Russian hack and leak operation targeting the D N C. We had to decide what to do. And in that moment with limited information, we made a mistake. He said, decisions aren't straightforward. These decisions aren't straightforward. And we wanted to avoid making the same mistakes as in 2016. So, you know, I, it's not inappropriate to ask these questions,

Jeff Jarvis (01:43:01):
But the way they were asked, it's kind

Leo Laporte (01:43:03):
Of, it's a little bit, you know, it's, but

Jeff Jarvis (01:43:04):
That's, and then the funny thing was they're trying to accuse the Democrats of interfering and they got the Twitter executives to say all the times the Trump tried to get Twitter to take down whoops.

Leo Laporte (01:43:14):
Posts.

Jeff Jarvis (01:43:15):
<Laugh>,

Leo Laporte (01:43:15):
Whoops. Yeah. Sometimes you don't want people to talk. Yeah. Big tech. This is James Comer, the chair of the committee. Oh, big tech autocrats, wield. They're unchecked power to suppress the speech of Americans to promote their preferred political opinions.

Jeff Jarvis (01:43:35):
Einstein,

Leo Laporte (01:43:36):
I think on the left or the right, most people, I mean, if they're using twi, I'm sorry. Ant really is dying, isn't he? Are you all right? <Laugh>?

Ant Pruitt (01:43:44):
It's more grandstanding crap from our government officials that we allegedly voted for that nothing but just sit and yell and wanna look pretty and nothing gets done. Not a dangone thing ever gets done.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:44:00):
Something has gotten done. The US government is working hard on cybersecurity and we have proof

Ant Pruitt (01:44:08):
Of that. Yeah. Word.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:44:11):
On, there was actually a story about, let's see, cisa, let's, here we go. Is this the

Leo Laporte (01:44:17):
Hive? So Hive

Ant Pruitt (01:44:18):
Last

Leo Laporte (01:44:19):
Week, is this the Hive story? And

Stacey Higginbotham (01:44:20):
This is kil net.

Leo Laporte (01:44:21):
K net. Okay. This, the HI is

Stacey Higginbotham (01:44:22):
A new one. What's the Hive story? Hold on, let me, let me see if you've got a story.

Leo Laporte (01:44:26):
Well, the Hive story from last week, that was when the F B I and other international law enforcement took down the Russian malware kind of as ranch, where as a service group hive. But this is another one. Kill Net DDoS. This is

Stacey Higginbotham (01:44:42):
A new

Leo Laporte (01:44:42):
One. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:44:43):
Yeah. And they're, they, they were going after hospitals and cisa, cisa, sorry, I said it.

Ant Pruitt (01:44:49):
Oh, cisa.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:44:50):
CISA was created as part of our efforts to, we were like, holy cow, cybersecurity is a total mess. This is terrible. And they created this agency a couple years ago and they've actually funded it and it does things and it's actually helping solve this. So, and then also, so that's good. But two, as part of the Omnibus Bill, we actually passed a cybersecurity law for medical devices. So now, if you wanna release a medical device that is connected to the internet, you a have to get it pre-certified, which is a big deal. Like you have to run to run it through the fda and they'll be like, did you pay attention to like pen testing and passwords? And they'll be like, yes, because we have to. Cuz if you say no, they won't let you release it. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> two, it calls for a software bill of materials. So while ANT is right, there's a lot of crappy grand standing. There's actually a couple areas where they're actually doing something and cybersecurity is one of them. So I'm very pleased. What's a health device? Is

Leo Laporte (01:45:48):
Your, is your, is your fitness watch

Stacey Higginbotham (01:45:50):
A health device? That is not, because it doesn't go before for any like, clearance before the FDA doesn't

Leo Laporte (01:45:56):
Require F fda. So this is like, but Oh, okay. It's some, some watches do, like, include the, the, the fibria defibrillator in the Apple Watch got F FDA clearance. Right?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:46:05):
Yeah. If you have f like that, that particular algorithm. But that's not a device. That's an, it's

Leo Laporte (01:46:10):
Not on a device. Be more like a pacemaker. If you had a pacemaker Yeah. That for some reason has controlled by an app. And this has been a problem. There have been pacemakers that could be hacked to stop your heart, which would be a bad thing.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:46:22):
Well, and it also, yeah. And it includes things like Bluetooth thermometers, cuz those are five five, I just wanna say 5 0 1 3 C, but five 10 K <laugh>,

Leo Laporte (01:46:33):
Except

Ant Pruitt (01:46:34):
Not quite the same.

Leo Laporte (01:46:35):
They're nonprofit thermometers. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:46:38):
So this, this is, and things in hospitals like infusion pumps, which is a thing that we're super worried about. Yes. Anyway, it's just good news. Our government did pass it and I was, was kind of amazed cuz in this was a law that they had had bipartisan support in April under the patch act, and then it just totally died. But they snuck it in the federal end of year budget bill. And it passed with all the things we wanted too. That was the other thing. They didn't compromise. Okay.

Ant Pruitt (01:47:08):
The last week on This Week in enterprise tech, they brought up NIST and the whole cybersecurity push. But it was, looks like it was directed more towards Iott, which still makes sense. It's, they're doing government's doing something about that for cybersecurity. I, I, I agree with that. But most of the time it's just a bunch of people wanting to, wanting to be seen on camera and heard on the social medias and do much of nothing.

Leo Laporte (01:47:34):
We have often excoriated Mr. Elon Musk. So it would be, it behooves me to se se send you the informa to celebrate the success of Elon in his, he had his day in court and found not liable over tweets proposing to take Tesla private,

Ant Pruitt (01:47:56):
Not liable. Not

Leo Laporte (01:47:57):
One hour deliberation. One hour, yeah. The jury clearly did not buy the contention of it was a it was a lawsuit from investors who said, Hey, we lost money because of this tweet that private equity funding had been you know arranged and that he was gonna take Tesla. Private people changed their investments based on that. And it turned out not to be true. Musk tweeted, thank goodness the wisdom of the people has prevailed. It is, it is by the way, possible to appeal this. Four years ago, the tweet, I'm am considering taking Tesla private at $420 funding secured, which it wasn't. He later tweeted, investor supporters confirmed, the only reason why this is not certain is it's contingent on a shareholder vote. Vote the s e c find him 20 million in 2018 over the tweet. Anne said, from now on, you gotta let, have a lawyer look at your, your tweets. Which he said no. And he doesn't. Apparently still so one of the investors testify this represented a threat to my livelihood, testifying his belief Tesla would go private, led him to liquidate his positions, but the jurors just didn't buy it. They said, no. Yes. You know, that's your own damn fault. <Laugh>. The jury formed person who said he wasn't persuaded by the arguments that the tweets were materials said the overall message. It just didn't land. There was nothing in there to give me an aha moment. This is why lawyers hate juries

Ant Pruitt (01:49:35):
<Laugh>. Yeah. Yeah. Do you agree with this?

Leo Laporte (01:49:38):
You charted up enough A yaha moment. I didn't know. Okay. Sorry. I'll work on that. During the trial, Tesla board members had sought distance themselves from Mr. Musk saying he was tweeting in his personal capacity. That was also persuasive. Said one juror. Well, you know, Elon just was doing his own thing. Joseph Grundfest, a former s e c commissioner, professor emeritus at Stanford Law School shocked everyone when he said, from that perspective, it's a coin toss. Who wants a coin toss when you could just split the baby? Worries. That was an aha moment. <Laugh>, I guess I don't even know why he said that. Nick's metaphor as much. Yeah. Don't toss the coin. Split the baby. Didn't Solomon say that? Forget the coin. Toss just split the baby <laugh>. It isn't the first time Mr. Musk's decision to part I'm reading from the Wall Street Journal to participate in litigation rather than settle his paid off. Remember he won his case against the British Splunk, who he called a Petto guy on Twitter. The jury sided with Mr. Musk. It helps, I think, to be a celebrity. I'm not, I may be wrong, but I think it helps to be a celebrity

Stacey Higginbotham (01:51:00):
And male.

Leo Laporte (01:51:01):
And they really

Stacey Higginbotham (01:51:02):
Hate

Leo Laporte (01:51:02):
Women. They don't Yeah. Amber

Stacey Higginbotham (01:51:03):
Heard women

Leo Laporte (01:51:04):
Say things, she's a celebrity, but they didn't like her.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:51:07):
They didn't like Amber heard, they didn't like, what's her name, the Theranos lady? Elizabeth Holmes. That's who it was.

Leo Laporte (01:51:13):
<Laugh> in 2020. That's true. She didn't get off like delete, did she? No. No. But even did Sunny Bani. So, and he was a guy still is. Yeah. So last time I checked in 2021,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:51:22):
But he's not white. I wonder if that is He's not

Leo Laporte (01:51:24):
White. Oh yeah, there you go. He has a, with a suspiciously European name. Sonny. In 2021, Mr. Musk was the loan Tesla board member to go on trial in a shareholder lawsuit of the company's acquisition of Solar City. Judge ruled in his favor last year. So Elon is, is one is three for oh, three for, how do you say that? You person three and Oh sir, three and Oh, thank you. He's batting a thousand. <Laugh> bating a thousand. Math is hard. <Laugh> Or three for three If you're talking baseball. Three for three. He's over the Mendoza line.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:52:05):
Wait, he's batting a thousand but isn't a four, is it? A

Leo Laporte (01:52:09):
Don't ask three of three. A hundred percent. A hundred percent is batting a thousand.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:52:15):
Yeah. Batting a thousand is a hundred percent. Isn't there something involving four in baseball? Or am I thinking just 4.0?

Leo Laporte (01:52:22):
This is 4 4 4 balls. Strike. a walk. Right. <laugh>. I'm thinking, is there any other four? I think that's the only four. No, that's, there's four bases. If you include, there's four bases. Even I know that well, but it's not, is home a base? It's a plate. It's not a base. It's a plate, not a base. There's three bases on a plate. This is why I hate baseball. This is why you always get into the Oh wow.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:52:45):
Okay. I'm sorry. I asked. I was, was,

Leo Laporte (01:52:47):
Yeah, you should be <laugh>. Oh, so batting averages. You move the desk four,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:52:52):
Don't

Leo Laporte (01:52:52):
You? The right.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:52:54):
Yep. I thought don't you have a, isn't there like a 4.0 batting average?

Leo Laporte (01:52:59):
You could have a 400. You could be bat in 400. Like the, you can splitted splinter Ted Williams. You sure could.

Ant Pruitt (01:53:05):
Yeah. But that's okay.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:53:06):
Maybe that's what

Ant Pruitt (01:53:06):
I'm, but that's still 40%.

Leo Laporte (01:53:08):
Yeah. Even the best

Stacey Higginbotham (01:53:09):
Hit, no one hits a hundred.

Leo Laporte (01:53:10):
Nobody hits a hundred percent. That's

Stacey Higginbotham (01:53:13):
Okay. That's what I'm thinking of. Okay. Batting 400. Thank y'all. That was helpful.

Leo Laporte (01:53:19):
<Laugh>. You could be batting four 50 or three 50 or five 50 or 600. I got it.

Ant Pruitt (01:53:24):
400. This is one number out of, oh, I

Leo Laporte (01:53:27):
Don't know

Stacey Higginbotham (01:53:27):
A hundred. Anything but Elon, I would rather talk about baseball

Leo Laporte (01:53:30):
Than Elon <laugh>. Wow. Ted Williams had a lifetime average of merely 304, 3 44. And yet he was also considered one of the greatest baseball headers of all time.

Ant Pruitt (01:53:44):
Tony Gwe.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:53:44):
And, how do you say it, it, Tony

Leo Laporte (01:53:46):
Gwen.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:53:46):
He was four. No, 400. How do you say?

Leo Laporte (01:53:50):
Well, you say 400, but it's printed four Oh oh

Stacey Higginbotham (01:53:53):
Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative>. Okay.

Leo Laporte (01:53:55):
So that's the confusion. He was the last Major league baseball player to hit over 400 in a season. Mr. Splitted split Ted Williams. Tony Gwen. What was his, what? It was

Ant Pruitt (01:54:04):
His, Tony Gwen was, I thought he was right there at 402. So he was pretty perfect

Leo Laporte (01:54:09):
According to the Ai <laugh>,

Ant Pruitt (01:54:12):
Ah, nivo says

Leo Laporte (01:54:14):
Ted Williams was the last major league baseball player to hit over 400 in his season. But let me see what Tony Gwen, Tony Gwen had, because he was a great hitter as well. For the, also for the Red Sox, right?

Ant Pruitt (01:54:26):
Padres. Oh, what

Stacey Higginbotham (01:54:27):
That dude from the Cardinals. Mark.

Ant Pruitt (01:54:30):
Mark McGuire.

Leo Laporte (01:54:31):
Oh, did we? Oh yeah. But he was Juice

Ant Pruitt (01:54:33):
Doesn't homeowner.

Leo Laporte (01:54:35):
That doesn't count. Tony Gwen's career batting averages is 3 38

Ant Pruitt (01:54:39):
3 38. Okay.

Leo Laporte (01:54:41):
Again, amazing. Right. That's really, really good. And it's only a third of the time.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:54:46):
What about pohs? Didn't he just do something like a year ago? And he,

Ant Pruitt (01:54:51):
Ted Williams in a long time, that's St. Louis Cardinals as well.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:54:56):
I know. That's, I have a Cardinals fan in my house. I only hear about the Cardinals <laugh>. That's the only, that's the only team I'm ever gonna

Leo Laporte (01:55:02):
Know. Pool holes. Batting average 2 96 career.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:55:08):
Oh, okay. He did something like within the last year or two that was notable, but I don't know what it was. We don't have to talk about baseball anymore. He

Leo Laporte (01:55:16):
Played for 22 seasons.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:55:19):
Yeah, he's

Leo Laporte (01:55:19):
Old. Pretty impressive. His pretty awesome.

Ant Pruitt (01:55:21):
Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:55:23):
Well, you know, pitchers and batters report soon, don't they?

Ant Pruitt (01:55:28):
Around the corner. Oh,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:55:29):
See,

Ant Pruitt (01:55:29):
It's almost springtime.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:55:32):
Okay.

Ant Pruitt (01:55:33):
And I'm not much of a baseball fan, but I know enough.

Leo Laporte (01:55:35):
Albert Holz, who bats right and throws right, weighs 235 pounds, born on January 16th, 1980 in Santo Domingo, Dominican Republic, drafted by the St. Louis Cardinals in the 13th round of the 1999 Major League Baseball. June amateur draft.

Ant Pruitt (01:55:57):
Mr. Jerry is seventh

Stacey Higginbotham (01:55:58):
Stretch for us

Leo Laporte (01:55:59):
Here. Yes. Here's your seventh stretch. You ready? You ready? It's time four.

Ant Pruitt (01:56:11):
There we go. It's a bras Boy. People are gonna love this episode.

Leo Laporte (01:56:22):
What? What the hell is that? That

Ant Pruitt (01:56:25):
Was the brass for your announcement.

Leo Laporte (01:56:28):
<Laugh>. Well, Google takes that. Okay. Google will soon blur explicit images by default in the search results. So if you wanna see those butts kids, you better turn off that safe search. <Laugh> the news setting automatically blurs.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:56:49):
I can't believe they didn't do that before. <Laugh>.

Leo Laporte (01:56:51):
I know <laugh>. I know it automatically. I know it automatically blurs, pornographic, violent or gory images. It can be disabled by anyone who doesn't have a supervised account. You have to be signed in in over 18. This is part, yesterday was safer internet day. So this new default search setting for everyone automatically will blur those nasty images. Even if you have

Stacey Higginbotham (01:57:19):
Could they also blur the pimple popping things because, oh God, those things pop up. Oh. Like anytime, anytime I see like I have to Google like a rash or something, like my kid has shingles. What does that look like? Or something? I'm like, this is gonna be so horrible. I

Leo Laporte (01:57:33):
Don't wanna see it. That there's actually a TV show and I see it in the TiVo listings all the time. Something like Professor Pimple Popper. And I, I just, I don't know why you'd wanna watch that TV show. No, not watching it by that name. I don't, I'd rather watch baseball for God's sake. Yeah. It's worse than baseball. <Laugh> Safe search. Okay. Here's to answer your question is already the default for signed in users under the age of 18. How does it know you're 18 though? Do you give it your age?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:58:00):
Google knows everything. Oh, Google knows how old I am. If you Google my name, it'll tell you that. It knows my spouse. It knows. And I've never told it any of this. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:58:08):
The Blur feature will be a new item within the safe search menu, along with the option to disable it entirely. You can also optionally hide explicit texts, links and pimples. <Laugh> disabling safe search entirely provides the most relevant results without hiding any pimples. Google is adding some new features for EVs with its built-in Google Maps. It'll now suggest this is a feature that, you know, Teslas have in their own maps. But it's, it's every ev wants this. It'll suggest charging stops. Even on shorter trips. It'll include a very fast filter. This you really need, when you're searching charging stations, you should be able to filter it by the charging stations that have the highest wattage. Sure. You get Yeah. The fastest charging. And it will show you in search results when a place has a charging station on site, Google adding big support in Google Maps

Jeff Jarvis (01:59:06):
And knowing, and it also knows what your plug is.

Leo Laporte (01:59:08):
It knows what your plug, you

Jeff Jarvis (01:59:11):
Tell it what your plug is. You tell it, tell it, tell you which which plug you have.

Leo Laporte (01:59:14):
Yeah. It knows. But it's just as out of a courtesy is gonna

Jeff Jarvis (01:59:17):
Ask. Yes, I think

Leo Laporte (01:59:18):
So. Even though it knows perfectly well <laugh>, as if I didn't know what kind of plug do you have?

Jeff Jarvis (01:59:24):
And, and by the way, you're not in your forties anymore. Liam knows that too.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:59:30):
So actually, let me ask you, if you Google my name, does it tell you who My spouse and how old I am? Because when I Google Ant, it doesn't tell me how old he is or his spouse.

Jeff Jarvis (01:59:38):
I'm doing something right.

Leo Laporte (01:59:40):
Stacey, do you have a Wikipedia entry?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:59:44):
No.

Leo Laporte (01:59:44):
Okay. Cuz that's where it gets all that information about me.

Jeff Jarvis (01:59:46):
It says you were are 44 years old and your partner is Andrew. Yep. Yeah. And okay. Now where did it get that?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:59:56):
I don't know where it got it from. I've never Is

Leo Laporte (01:59:58):
That the knowledge crash panel? Because I don't see that here. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's not, it's not. Well,

Jeff Jarvis (02:00:03):
What are you using? Using Neva? Yeah, you're using Neva? Yeah, he's using Neva. Oh, she asked Google.

Leo Laporte (02:00:07):
No, cuz I like Neva. I'm never using Google again.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:00:10):
<Laugh>. I know, but I was asking to see what Google showed people who weren't me. Because sometimes Google

Jeff Jarvis (02:00:14):
Also Google personalized

Leo Laporte (02:00:16):
Google. Do you want me to do it? As a incognito or just like as me?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:00:22):
They, they already did it. It's all good.

Jeff Jarvis (02:00:23):
Yeah. Well, what's interesting, Stacey, is now this is very fancy. I wish I could show you picture. Oh, look at picture. But it has pictures, has fancy pictures of you look at picture and your car look. Yeah. Yeah. And then it has box in my car. A partner box.

Leo Laporte (02:00:34):
Somebody age box. Oh my God. Look at this partner box and age box. That's ridiculous. You're only 44. Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (02:00:43):
Yeah. I don't get any of that. <Laugh> Stacey gets the glam treatment. <Laugh>. I don't get any of 'em. What about Leo La? I

Stacey Higginbotham (02:00:49):
Don't know if I want people knowing my age if they search me, but

Jeff Jarvis (02:00:53):
Okay. Leo gets the, oh, look at Leo's. Do

Leo Laporte (02:00:55):
I get the glam treatment?

Jeff Jarvis (02:00:57):
Oh, you get the glam treatment.

Leo Laporte (02:00:58):
Oh, I do. Oh, look at movies Hackers wanted. That's hysterical. That's the movie I did that many years ago. Hackers wanted

Jeff Jarvis (02:01:06):
That's

Leo Laporte (02:01:06):
Bizarre. That's nice. That's really bizarre that that came up. I don't know why that did. Huh? So that's what Google does. But I'm logged in. What if I do it as an incognito search? Well, I guess it did it for you too, didn't it, Jeff? I'm

Jeff Jarvis (02:01:19):
Doing it for Yeah. Just as myself. And it pulled up the same thing of you.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:01:23):
Yeah. If you're, if you're a public,

Jeff Jarvis (02:01:25):
Not much for Mr. Nervous though. I don't get it. <Laugh>. You all three have it and I don't have it.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:01:31):
They classify us as a journalist. Like when I, when I search Ant, it tells me he's a journalist.

Jeff Jarvis (02:01:36):
Just a journalist. You professor. Even though I did write, but I'm a, I am so upset.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:01:41):
Oh, Jeff, let me help you. Let

Leo Laporte (02:01:43):
Look, I get when I, I type in Ant Pruitt in the event of a car accident. It's important not to keep driving <laugh>. Call the police if anyone has killed

Ant Pruitt (02:01:53):
Beats being called a train wreck.

Leo Laporte (02:01:55):
Why am I getting that?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:01:56):
Oh, Jeff, it does know you. It says your wife is Tammy.

Leo Laporte (02:02:00):
Is that true? You've never said your wife's name. 68. You're 68. Sorry. Eight. How do you survive?

Jeff Jarvis (02:02:07):
I know.

Leo Laporte (02:02:08):
<Laugh>. God.

Jeff Jarvis (02:02:09):
I mean, we survive my years. It was a very good year.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:02:15):
Oh, we were doing the cr we were doing the, the change log. I'm so sorry. I just, I got curious.

Ant Pruitt (02:02:20):
<Laugh>. It's

Leo Laporte (02:02:21):
So easy to get distracted from the change log. It's interesting how they treat different people differently. That is very odd. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Back to the change log, whatever that was. Google has announced improved contextual translation features. Wait a minute, this is the wrong

Jeff Jarvis (02:02:43):
Article. This is the wrong link.

Leo Laporte (02:02:45):
No, I don't know anything about this one. So I don't know. That might

Jeff Jarvis (02:02:49):
Be my fault. No, I didn't put that one in there. I

Leo Laporte (02:02:53):
Don't know. Google Wines down feature that put, oh, this is not good. That put playable podcasts. Yeah. Put this one in here directly in search results. So you, it, so if I search for, it's taking,

Jeff Jarvis (02:03:07):
He's taking the carousel out.

Leo Laporte (02:03:08):
This, I'll have to go to Google. Cause I, let's see what Neva does This Week in Google. So it used to be be the Carousel would have a latest. There is a nice link. For some reason it's decided to tell me about Google. Making it already knows what our stories are gonna be. <Laugh>

Ant Pruitt (02:03:28):
<Laugh>. Look at that. Look at that dude. Where is it getting at from?

Jeff Jarvis (02:03:33):
Wait a

Leo Laporte (02:03:34):
Minute. Twitter TV podcast, apple do com. Tom's guides eating@thesun.co.uk and audible.com.

Ant Pruitt (02:03:41):
Hey, where's it getting at from? Are does it have access to your rundown?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:03:47):
No, it's probably giving us

Jeff Jarvis (02:03:48):
The most last week, the

Stacey Higginbotham (02:03:49):
Most weekly information from What's the biggest story in

Leo Laporte (02:03:53):
Google right now? But it doesn't have a playable talked about last week playback. So Google. I mean, it does have a link to YouTube, I guess. You know, you could go there. But So you're saying if I go to Google, it used to, if I search for this, we can Google used

Jeff Jarvis (02:04:04):
To have a well, it still does. It has a a, a, a carousel.

Leo Laporte (02:04:10):
Hmm. Not for me.

Jeff Jarvis (02:04:12):
And I can play from there.

Leo Laporte (02:04:14):
I'm just getting that.

Ant Pruitt (02:04:19):
Yeah.

Leo Laporte (02:04:20):
Coming to

Jeff Jarvis (02:04:21):
That is such a dorky theme song. Jesus

Leo Laporte (02:04:24):
<Laugh>.

Ant Pruitt (02:04:26):
I love our song. Don't, don't ever change

Stacey Higginbotham (02:04:29):
It. I I do not. I mean,

Jeff Jarvis (02:04:31):
I want something built. I want, I want, I want AI to build a theme song. Stacey

Ant Pruitt (02:04:36):
Tiger. Our, our song. That song and, and your choir singing your praises to Craig Newmart. Those, those things bring me joy each and every Wednesday. How

Leo Laporte (02:04:45):
About this? You like the new Google change log theme?

Jeff Jarvis (02:04:48):
<Laugh>, <laugh>

Leo Laporte (02:04:55):
Come from somebody. Send us

Jeff Jarvis (02:04:57):
That <laugh>.

Ant Pruitt (02:05:01):
I'm down with

Leo Laporte (02:05:01):
It. Can I get a chat, g p t to write themes? Write a new

Jeff Jarvis (02:05:07):
Music. Music was the last week theme

Leo Laporte (02:05:10):
For talk about last week, week in Google. Maybe, maybe I could just use it. Would it, if it, would it be legal if I did this?

Jeff Jarvis (02:05:17):
Yeah.

Leo Laporte (02:05:18):
If I, if it

Jeff Jarvis (02:05:19):
Makes music. I don't know if it makes music.

Leo Laporte (02:05:20):
Well, I don't know.

Jeff Jarvis (02:05:21):
Chad. C PT doesn't sing Google.

Leo Laporte (02:05:24):
Oh, Google. A place of

Jeff Jarvis (02:05:26):
A place of innovation. Knowledge full of inspiration. Chorus. A world to explore. We trusted you and so much more. Okay, everybody in the chorus. Come on, let's go. Let's see it again. Let's go to the chorus. Come on. Shut, shut

Leo Laporte (02:05:42):
The screen so we can all sing. You

Jeff Jarvis (02:05:44):
Lead the way and let, do rhythms and always come through

Leo Laporte (02:05:52):
From answering

Jeff Jarvis (02:05:53):
Questions. Your well fast

Leo Laporte (02:05:57):
Place Google.

Ant Pruitt (02:05:59):
Here's a bridge. Mr. Jarvis won't cross that. He'll stop right

Leo Laporte (02:06:03):
There. Oh yeah. Notice <laugh>. We can, we can. He'll just leave him behind.

Jeff Jarvis (02:06:06):
Oh, Google, you bring us together from four and mine in all kinds of weather. A friend to us all in times of Google. You're always trusted. Indeed. Our

Ant Pruitt (02:06:20):
Trust is Steve, do you wanna complain about the current trusted

Jeff Jarvis (02:06:22):
Steve? Our trust? Well, you it off the screen, Steve. I couldn't see

Leo Laporte (02:06:25):
It. Oh, Google, we raise a toast to you for all you do and all that you do. We'll always be grateful for all that you bring Google. You are our king.

Jeff Jarvis (02:06:33):
Okay. Okay. We now. Hello people out there somewhere in our land. You've gotta sing this with us to music. We need, this is our new theme song. This is it. Please

Ant Pruitt (02:06:42):
Don't,

Jeff Jarvis (02:06:42):
This is it. Please,

Ant Pruitt (02:06:43):
Please don't. The folks that are listening are way more talented. So do it that way if you

Leo Laporte (02:06:48):
Want. Meanwhile,

(02:06:50):
Google announced launches Android 14 developer preview for pixel. So if you've got a pixel and you wanna take a look at the Android 14 developer preview it is out now. This is the eighth year in a row that Google provides an early look at the direction. Android is going ahead of the stable launch, which usually happens in the third quarter. For the very first release, there are five tent poles, starting with working across device inform factors. Android 14 bills on the work done in Android 12 l and 13 to support tablets. Oh, foldables.

Jeff Jarvis (02:07:30):
Hmm. Oh

Leo Laporte (02:07:33):
Users will be able to scale your font up to 200%. That's a lot more than current. A grammatical inflection API will let developers more easily add support for users who speak languages, which have grammatical gender. Hmm.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:07:50):
Grammatical

Leo Laporte (02:07:51):
Gender. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:07:53):
Oh, like feminine and masculine. Yeah. Okay. Sorry. Yeah. Okay. I was like, what is grammatical? Search

Leo Laporte (02:07:58):
The porch porch to improve privacy and security. Android 14 will prevent apps with targets SDK version lower than 23, which is Android six from being installed. So if you've got old apps, you might wanna update those. Streamlining background work. Anyway, a bunch of new features. Get that developer preview. The new one Plus phone came out yesterday. Jason Howell has it. He did a re I believe he did a review on all about Android yesterday. He was planning on doing that. That will also appear on our TWiT tech break feed. Now, the thing that's interesting is they are not gonna offer it to in any US carrier's stores, including T-Mobile, which one Plus has been offering their funds in. So without US carrier support, even though this is the first one plus phone that supports 5G from all the carriers, you gotta wonder if, if really at this point it's, it's Google or Samsung or nothing. I And that's where's the <laugh> <laugh>? That's it. It's over the change log. We need kas for the end too. We need,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:09:17):
There we go. Be song said. No one ever

Leo Laporte (02:09:20):
<Laugh> Camera B rules. He is awesome. <Laugh>. Totally, totally awesome. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Let's do a final commercial and picks of the weekend. We can all go home. I, I don't know if you've noticed, I'm a little feisty. I'm a little, I'm a little peppy today. You know, you know why? Cuz I got a great night's sleep. Got a great night's sleep. Sleep as it has been said is nature's gentle nurse. It's the ultimate game changer. And my Eight Sleep Pod Cover is the ultimate sleep machine. I love it. Consistent. Good sleep helps with so many health issues. Like it could decrease the risk of heart disease. It can lower your blood pressure. There's even some evidence that good sleep, especially that deep sleep that cleans the brain, can reduce the risk of Alzheimer's. But more and more in the 21st century, we're having trouble sleeping.

(02:10:21):
Let me ask you folks, friends, do you have trouble falling asleep? Do you wake up my friends in the middle of the night? Do you argue with your partner over the thermostat? Well, I can help you. The eighth sleep Pod Cover works hard all night long to improve your sleep. So you don't have to, and I'm not just blowing smoke. I have the Eight Sleep Pod Cover and Lisa and I love it. Love it when we get in bed. And by the way, that's the only cover that has temperature control. Dual zone as low as 55 degrees. That's chilly. Or 110 degrees. That's hot Fahrenheit gives you the optimal temperature and each side gets their own. So Lisa likes it, a little cozier than I do sometimes. She'll say, come on, just reach over to my side, feel that. And I go, wow, that's hot.

(02:11:10):
And she said, yeah. And I say, reach over to my son. And she goes, huh, it's so cool. I said, yeah, that's <laugh> a dramatization. But you know, you get the idea based on your, it's based on not only your own biometrics and your sleep stages. It's based on the room temperature too. In fact, we save money with the Eight Sleep cuz I don't have to turn on the heat or the air conditioning at night. You know, the worst thing in the world. Summertime, it's hot, sleeping hot. Nobody wants to do that. But sometimes even in the winter, you know, you get chilly, you turn on the heat, you wake up at three in the morning and you're sweating bullets not with the Eight Sleep. It senses your temperature, the temperature of the room, and it keeps you comfortable. And it's an interesting fact that it, we wanna start warm, you know, we're going to bed.

(02:11:58):
But then as the night progresses, it helps you go into deep sleep. If it gets cooler, a little bit cooler and your body slows down and you get, and you get in that deep sleep cycle, and you, on average, people who use the Eight Sleep cover get 30% better deep sleep. That makes a huge difference. I was getting, I'm getting about 50%. It went from an hour to an hour and a half a night. That's amazing. It also has sensors to track your health and sleep metrics. So every morning you can get up, you can, you don't have to wear anything. You don't, you know, it's easy. You just get up, you can look at your phone and you'll see how you slept. Better. Sleep is the health habit you'll love. Sticking to night after night. And everybody who's got one of these, I hear from people all the time. I started with Kevin Rosie, who's the first one to tell me about this. I was a little skeptical, but then Amy Webb was on the same show, this is a couple of years ago, said, oh, Kevin, I got it. It was great. It changed my life. So we got one about a year ago. We've gone through now summer and winter. I could tell you, you just got one, didn't you? Yeah. Do you like it? Be honest. Tell me the truth. It's

Ant Pruitt (02:12:59):
Outstanding. And then look at the graph. Well, you can't see it, but it go

Leo Laporte (02:13:03):
Says go ahead. Show, show his graph show. He's got a on

Ant Pruitt (02:13:05):
Screen. 93%. 93%, 86% overall because I slept like a hibernated.

Leo Laporte (02:13:12):
Makes a difference. Grizzly

Ant Pruitt (02:13:13):
Bear. It

Leo Laporte (02:13:14):
Was, it's so nice.

Ant Pruitt (02:13:15):
Oh, I love

Leo Laporte (02:13:15):
That thing. So nice. Better sleep. It's a health habit that you will, you'll actually love. You know, you'll, you'll say, oh, I can get into better sleep. Sure. Night after night you wake up fully energized with a Pod Cover you can tackle whatever life throws at you. It's just the best thing ever. I'm a huge fan. Lisa is a huge fan. I strongly recommend you check it out. Go to Eight Sleep. E i g Whoa. Whoa. You showed me mine. Yours. I'll show you mine. You wanna see mine? My, my sleep last night? 93. 93. That's a pretty good sleep score. Quality. 95 routine. 88 maybe. I went to bed a little late. Total time. Slept eight hours and nine minutes. 93%. That's, that's pretty dark for me. That's, that's an amazing, I mean, I was getting 50% before we got the Eight Sleep Pod Cover.

(02:14:11):
Save $150 a checkout right now on the Pod Cover Eight Sleep. Currently ships within the usa, Canada, the uk Select countries in the eu. And yeah, I know it's a hot summer this year in Australia. They shipped to Australia too. Never again. Suffer, suffer with temperature. Look at that. 93. I'm glad I checked. I haven't. That's really impressive. Wow. Quality, 95%. You also see your stages, you know, you see, you see how long you spent in deep sleep? Hour and 10 minutes, 14% in deep sleep. REM sleep. That's the dreaming sleep. Right? Two hours, 19 minutes. That's, that's all of this is good. This is all good heart rate. 61. H R V. That's heart rate variability, right? 34 milliseconds. That's good. It's supposed to be below 35. Breathing rate in range. 20.7 breaths a minute. What, what's your breathing rate, Mr. I'm so fit, curious. Where's

Ant Pruitt (02:15:15):
My breath?

Leo Laporte (02:15:16):
So you go to the full page, get the full stats,

Ant Pruitt (02:15:20):
Breathing rain's. A the bottom breathing rate as time slept routine. There it is. Breathing rate 14.20.

Leo Laporte (02:15:27):
You beat me. <Laugh>.

Ant Pruitt (02:15:30):
Imagine that Sir

Leo Laporte (02:15:32):
Lisa and I do that. We'll wake up in the morning. You should say, how much sleep did you get? How good was your sleep score? She'll sometimes say she show, she'll put it in my face. 99 <laugh>. 99. I say, you're young. I'm old. Eight Sleep.com/twi. Save $150 a checkout on the Pod Cover. It's not a competition. Eight Sleep.com/twi. Okay. Maybe it's a little bit of a competition. Eight Sleep die. Then she'll go Word Lynn two

Ant Pruitt (02:16:01):
<Laugh>. Another story.

Leo Laporte (02:16:04):
<Laugh>. She's better than me. I can, I have to admit that she's just better than me in every way. Eight Sleep.com/TWiT. We thank 'em so much for supporting the show. Real quickly, I just there's so many stories that Jeff put in. Hey, PE <laugh>. Oh, this is one I do want to do and I want you to tell me all about this. We saw this last week. It was kind of a shock. We have had on this show many times, Joan Donovan, we love Joan Donovan. Mm-Hmm. She's an expert on misinformation. She was at the the SCH team Kennedy

Jeff Jarvis (02:16:43):
School. She

Leo Laporte (02:16:44):
Was a center founder of the Kennedy Scene Center. No

Jeff Jarvis (02:16:46):
Media of a, of a cer Yes, go ahead.

Leo Laporte (02:16:49):
Medias center on media, politics and public policy. Right. Doing a research project. She wrote a book. This is at Harvard, at the Kennedy School, which is their school of politics, Institute of Politics. Forced to leave by the dean according to sources. Now I figured you'd have the inside story on this, Jeff.

Jeff Jarvis (02:17:08):
I have a few inside stories. This comes right after the same deed tried to stop Kenneth Roth, former head of Human Rights watch, universally respected from being a fellow there, there was outcry and Roth was then made a fellow earlier there were earlier activities that were at the Kennedy Center, including first draft, which was major, major important entity in disinformation was kind of forced out. IB Wells, Nicole Hannah Jones's Center was forced out. That was a whole story a while ago. Same dean, as far as I know. And then Joan forced out. And the argument they're making is that centers at Harvard are supposed to be run by faculty and she's not tenure track faculty. And so she really can't do this. Now they've known that she wasn't tenure track faculty for a, for years. And she's went there.

Leo Laporte (02:18:02):
She was never tenured track

Jeff Jarvis (02:18:03):
Four years, four years ago, right? No. She was there as a

Leo Laporte (02:18:05):
Researcher. Ridiculous. Not professor.

Jeff Jarvis (02:18:09):
One view is the some four did more reporting on it. One argument is that she got into a tiff with former Facebook executive. I doubt that that's it. We really just don't know. And well, I've seen again and again and again, Harvard is just a not nice place.

Leo Laporte (02:18:28):
Tensions rose between the Dean and Donovan in fall of 2021, according to three. This is from the K Crimson Harvard's own student publication. Three HKS staff members around when Donovan started to work on the Kennedy School's Facebook archive project. Fb archive.org. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Well, that was because they wanted to, she wanted to put all of the whistleblowers documents from Francis b Hogan Inn. And was it formed? Maybe you shouldn't. Now, at roughly the same time, mark Zuckerberg committed half a billion dollars to Harvard's Neuroscience and AI Institute. So I, maybe there's a connection. Maybe not. But this is Harvard's, you know, favorite son, big donor. And he just happens to run Facebook. And here's somebody who's in charge, who's a researcher on misinformation, wants to add in misinformation information from Facebook and this Facebook archive.org site. Joan herself has not made a comment and has not said anything about this at all as far as I know.

Jeff Jarvis (02:19:35):
No, I, I I emailed her just to say, thinking of you. And she said there were other people who could tell the story. There's a, there's a larger story here that's interesting, gang. Which is that, you know, and I, I got money from my school, got money from Facebook to deal with disinformation stuff back in the day after 2016. And now disinformation ain't cool anymore as a field. I know one major think tank is moving away from it. First draft is no longer doing this. Joan is kicked out of, of, of here. There was a, there was a international Communications Association conference in Paris asking what comes after this information research. It's kind of had its big day. And so that's an interesting question. Was it, was it seen as a fad? Was it seen as Cambridge Analytica Wasn't that bad after all? Oh,

Leo Laporte (02:20:26):
It's over. We don't have to worry about it. It's nothing.

Jeff Jarvis (02:20:29):
It's like Covid. It's like covid. Yeah. They're treated the same way. Joan did important work. I don't agree with everything she says. Joan's brilliant. She's brave. She's been, you know, she's, she's going after people who are not nice people. And we need someone like Joan to do this. And it sucks. Majorly.

Leo Laporte (02:20:47):
Yeah. I hope some other school picks her up and says, yeah, you know what, this needs to be done. This.

Jeff Jarvis (02:20:54):
She's a great researcher.

Leo Laporte (02:20:55):
Something we need to research. Super smart. She's been on the show many at times. We always want to have her on. I'll she may not want be on right now, but I'll ask her. We'll ask her to get her on soon. But actually you're not here next week, are you? I guess we got Mike next week. No, we've got Mike Elgan already. But you

Jeff Jarvis (02:21:09):
Got Mike. Yeah. Next week.

Leo Laporte (02:21:10):
Yeah. 

Jeff Jarvis (02:21:11):
Stacey's not here the week after.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:21:12):
I'm not here in two weeks. Okay.

Leo Laporte (02:21:14):
Hey, maybe Jason Howell, you could contact Joan and see if we can get her on.

Jeff Jarvis (02:21:17):
It was already on the case.

Leo Laporte (02:21:18):
Oh, he says. I already have. Just waiting to hear back. And you could tell her if you don't want to talk about this, you don't have to. But we do want to talk about misinformation. And, you know, this is academia. You know, Jeff, you're, you're mired in academia.

Jeff Jarvis (02:21:32):
Oh, tell me about it. It's,

Leo Laporte (02:21:34):
It's very politic political and very, you know, it may not even be malicious. It's, it's just, you know, it's just what happens. I grew up in academia. My dad's a professor. That's just what happens. But still, I think Joan should find a, a seat somewhere. She's, you know, give her a, she's professorship. Give her a, yeah, give her a professor. Put her on the tenure

Jeff Jarvis (02:21:55):
Chair. She, she's a writer. She's a researcher. Yeah. She's great. And she's funny.

Leo Laporte (02:22:00):
She's smart. Yeah. Importantly to me. She's smart. I'll do the funny <laugh>. All right. Let's get your pick of the week. Stacey Hiba. What do you like? What do you see? What do you know?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:22:15):
All right. This is an app. This is a little late because I didn't do dry January cuz I was sick. But I am doing a dry February. Cuz

Leo Laporte (02:22:24):
What is that? You, you can, what does that entail? Because you can

Stacey Higginbotham (02:22:27):
Because I can. Yeah. Cause it just is basically like, not drinking all

Leo Laporte (02:22:31):
Month, but just for a month, February. So, and as, and by the way, I wanna point out the shortest month of the year. <Laugh>. Yes. Okay.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:22:40):
Yes. All of this is true. Although if we think about it, I haven't had a drink in like a week and a half at least. So, you know, I feel like I've already started.

Leo Laporte (02:22:49):
You can make your own month. Stacey. Day to date, it's a month. You declare

Stacey Higginbotham (02:22:54):
What my,

Leo Laporte (02:22:55):
So why just a month though? What I'm saying is what's, what do you get from just not drinking for a month?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:23:00):
So actually, so far my heart rate variability, that was one of my goals. Oh.

Leo Laporte (02:23:05):
Cause just to see what happens.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:23:06):
Increased. Yeah. Yeah. And so, okay. And you know, I also, I was like, you know, I drink a lot when I'm bored or just to mark like the end of the day. And I was like, that's not

Leo Laporte (02:23:17):
Good. That's a bad thing. 

Stacey Higginbotham (02:23:18):
Yeah. Yeah. And I don't, I don't, I mean, like, I was drinking maybe seven or eight drinks a week, but it still felt like

Leo Laporte (02:23:26):
I did no nut November and I haven't had a nut since. It's, once you do it, it's easy. It just, it gets you, it teaches you that you can, right. I've, I've had a no brussel sprout here. <Laugh>. <laugh>.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:23:41):
I have Brussels sprouts right now in my fridge.

Leo Laporte (02:23:43):
Yeah. Noss twenties.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:23:46):
Yeah. so to, to do this and possibly to like help me just instead of like, cuz eventually I would like to drink again. Right? Like, it's very easy to be like, well I'm not gonna drink for a month. I would

Leo Laporte (02:23:58):
Like, so someday it's a good ambition. <Laugh>, someday I would like to drink again.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:24:05):
The point is, I would like to drink mindfully. As, as yes. As the kids say. Very good.

Leo Laporte (02:24:10):
So very good. I,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:24:11):
I have this support. I, I tried this app. It's called Sunnyside Mindful Drinking. And it, it's 15 days for free. But then you pay, I think it's like nine bucks a month or like 80 bucks a year. But it's actually text. It can be all text based. You don't actually have to use the app and you just text it and you're like, Hey, it, it offers you, like, you take a quiz, it'll be like, this is how much you should be drinking. But you can also just set your own parameters. So if you say like, Hey, I wanna have five dry days a week and drink only two drinks. What you do is you text your goals to the app and you're like, Hey, I wanna drink two drinks today cuz I'm going out for a party or whatever, but I only wanna drink two. Then it basically sends you a text and it's like, Hey, did you only drink two drinks? And you're like, no, I drank three. And then it's like, oh, well here, here's how to help you stick to your goals and all of this stuff. And it's kind of nice. Like the same way writing down what you eat kind of helps you not eat stupid food. It helps me anyway. This is helping me. Well it's not helping me at this moment, but I can see it helping me. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (02:25:20):
It's like

Stacey Higginbotham (02:25:21):
Noom stick to my,

Leo Laporte (02:25:21):
It's like noom for booze. I mean, that makes sense.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:25:23):
Noom is evil.

Leo Laporte (02:25:25):
Well, Noom is, Noom is Monster. So I'd like to argue with you on that point. <Laugh>

Stacey Higginbotham (02:25:30):
Noom only tracks. Noom only puts you in like the least amount of calories you can eat. It's horrib

Leo Laporte (02:25:36):
Harmful. No, that's not true. You get to choose there's a little bunny and there's a, there's a cheetah.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:25:42):
I've, I've seen it. I looked at, I looked at

Leo Laporte (02:25:44):
Noom. Yeah. Le Lisa and I both do Noom and we, I've know many people including Brianna Wu lost a hundred pounds. One of our one of our regulars in our club TWiT lost 60 pounds. He was on our cruise. I, I saw him. I said, I, I was looking for him. I said, where are you? You're not on the cruise. He says, I'm right next to you. I just, he's like, what the hell? It's not the half of you is gone. So you can, you don't have to like noom. But I, we, we've

Stacey Higginbotham (02:26:09):
Used Noom reactivated an eating disorder. So I was not

Leo Laporte (02:26:12):
Pleased. Well, that's a different, you know what, you shouldn't do noom if you have an eating disorder. I completely agree with you. I'm like, you know what, I'm

Stacey Higginbotham (02:26:19):
Completely is not helpful. No.

Leo Laporte (02:26:22):
Similarly, if you're an a alcoholic, I wouldn't use Sunnyside.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:26:25):
I mean Right. That is, that is something to say. If you Yeah. If this is an issue for you, this is not the app. But if you're just like, Hey, I noticed my drinking's getting outta hand and I'd like to like be a little bit more accountable about it without like, I don't know, telling my spouse or having someone like try to nag me about it. Yeah. This is just nagging

Leo Laporte (02:26:43):
Via text. Do not warn you if you, if you have an eating disorder, I'm pretty sure they do. They say, no,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:26:48):
Don't use this. Noom, when I took the quiz, it it like, they didn't ask you, huh. Here's how you will achieve your goals. And it was like, you will eat 1200 calories a day. And I was like,

Leo Laporte (02:26:57):
<Laugh>. Oh, well that's crazy. I see. My goal is I just don't want to be a, a fat tubby guy. And so that was my goal was I just, I a couple of pounds a year. That's fine. You could set your goal

Stacey Higginbotham (02:27:10):
During the quiz. It pushes you like during the intro quiz. Oh, okay. That's fair. It's like, I'm like, I would like to lose half a pound a week. And it's like, oh, you know, and I would like to lose a total of 15 pounds.

Leo Laporte (02:27:22):
Yeah. Like that's reasonable. We

Stacey Higginbotham (02:27:23):
Could do that. But it was also, it was like, but you could be at this weight not in June. Right. Which is one option, but April if you

Leo Laporte (02:27:32):
Do this. Right, right. Lisa, who's on kind of maintenance lost I think five or 10 pounds. She didn't need much to lose much and has kept it off. And I think she, of course she's not, if, if something says, oh, you should do this differently, she goes, no thank you. I'm gonna do it my way. So she is not easily pushed into something, but God Yeah. If you had a, if you've got an eating disorder, you should probably stay away from most diets. Right. I mean, that seems like a bad idea.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:27:59):
Yes. I'm sorry, I didn't insult your sponsor.

Leo Laporte (02:28:01):
No, you can insult them. No, I think that's fair. It's,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:28:03):
I'm like fair. It was not, it was not a good option for me today. No, this is my app like that I'm playing with and I really, this is cool. Like, it it is a lot of texting.

Leo Laporte (02:28:14):
Ah.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:28:14):
So I will let you know that I like the texting because I hate apps. <Laugh>. And you don't have to use the app. You can just do everything on the website or on an app. I mean, there is an app. So if you hate a lot of texts

Leo Laporte (02:28:28):
Interact with you a lot through the day.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:28:32):
It can it basically you tell it in the morning like, Hey, this is my goal for the day. Okay. And then, then it'll ask you, yeah,

Leo Laporte (02:28:42):
Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:28:42):
Did you, did you meet your goal? And then you're like, no. Or Yes. Nice. and then it does it again the next day.

Leo Laporte (02:28:50):
Is it, does it free? Is it charged charge anything?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:28:54):
15 days free. And then there's a variety of plans that range from like nine to, I think $12 a month depending on how long you do it. So that's just, you know, I've been playing around with it. I thought it was good

Leo Laporte (02:29:07):
For Aish February, <laugh> Sunnyside,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:29:11):
They call it, they call it a, if you, if you wanna drink, it's a damp February. A damp for a damp January.

Leo Laporte (02:29:16):
You know, I think mindful is always good. Whether whatever you're consuming mindful is a great idea. I agree a hundred percent. Sunnyside.Co. C o

Stacey Higginbotham (02:29:28):
It's do co. Sorry. Yes.

Leo Laporte (02:29:30):
Mr. Jeff Jarvis, do you have a number of the week?

Jeff Jarvis (02:29:33):
Can we, can we play the Google Super Bowl commercial?

Leo Laporte (02:29:38):
Sure.

Jeff Jarvis (02:29:39):
Line 58.

Leo Laporte (02:29:40):
Sure. we'll just edit it out of the YouTube. No,

Jeff Jarvis (02:29:46):
Really? Yeah, no, we won't do it. No, no,

Leo Laporte (02:29:48):
No, no, no. I insist I don't No, no, no. I don't like to have the the chilling effect

Jeff Jarvis (02:29:55):
Commercial. You gotta take out

Leo Laporte (02:29:57):
These companies are everything and if we put anything Yeah, almost certainly they'll do a take down. So they've been taking down almost everything. Yeah. They'll take anything down. This has music in it, they'll take it down. So what we do though, I mean obviously we don't get taken down from our podcast feed, so we do with anything we put on YouTube, we just turn it into a slideshow without audio. So if you're watching on YouTube, subscribe to the podcast. So you get the full thing. It's called Fixed on pixel. Right.

Jeff Jarvis (02:30:28):
So there's actually, there's an interesting piece here

Leo Laporte (02:30:32):
To it. Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (02:30:33):
The joke is you can, you can erase things from images, right? Yep. So then Amy Schumer says, oh, then I can erase all my boyfriends from the past <laugh>. That's the joke. So we, we gave the joke <laugh>, but what's interesting to me in all this time of, you know, oh, oh, deep fakes and fake news and, and and how do you know it's real? I haven't really seen this. This really kind of brings it home that wow, you know, I, this, this is nothing new in this, but the way it's

Stacey Higginbotham (02:31:05):
Advertised. Stalin did it.

Jeff Jarvis (02:31:06):
<Laugh>. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. There's

Leo Laporte (02:31:08):
Nothing new on this.

Jeff Jarvis (02:31:10):
Nope. Nope. But it kind of makes it say, oh boy, this is gonna be everywhere. So it's interesting that it was, it was

Leo Laporte (02:31:15):
Advertised. So just so you know super Bowl commercial this year is 7 million for 30 seconds. They will probably air this multiple times. The full commercial's a minute and a half, 21 million. But a lot of times they don't air the full commercial. Right. They are snippets. We'll air the full commercial and I will only charge Google half what they would pay for the Super Bowl. So how about that? But you don't need to hear it now. I just described it. It's fine. For years, our phones have captured memories. Oh. There's a picture of a bride and a husband, a young mom on the ski slope with a son family on the beach and a brother with his sister. But now it's time to fix them. Missy Elliot taking the other kid out of the picture. Yeah. This is the taking the dog pooping outta the ski slope. Taking the fat guy with the Frisbee out of the family picture on the beach. And who needs the groom when you got the bride? I can

Speaker 10 (02:32:14):
Erase my exes.

Leo Laporte (02:32:18):
All the Xs.

Speaker 10 (02:32:19):
I don't even remember this guy.

Leo Laporte (02:32:21):
<Laugh> Donnis. What about that dunk in the third quarter?

Speaker 10 (02:32:24):
What? Dunk?

Leo Laporte (02:32:27):
That's a famous sports

Speaker 10 (02:32:29):
Athlete. Not anymore. And he been there the whole thing.

Leo Laporte (02:32:34):
Embarrassing T-shirt and an old man in the pool.

Ant Pruitt (02:32:40):
Yeah.

Leo Laporte (02:32:40):
And a person named Doja ka A sad off key harmonica plays. We run this.

Speaker 10 (02:32:50):
Oh, now it's giving.

Leo Laporte (02:32:51):
Oh, that's cool.

Speaker 10 (02:32:53):
That

Leo Laporte (02:32:54):
Is sad. It fix it animates. It fixes awesome.

Speaker 10 (02:32:56):
Totally awesome.

Leo Laporte (02:32:57):
It's totally awesome.

Ant Pruitt (02:33:00):
This is one of the same stuff they said when the phones was launched last year on the sixth. That's

Leo Laporte (02:33:06):
Do it all. It's a point. It's a good point. Commercial. It doesn't have to be new for you. I found your new coffee machine Ant on line 86. Oh

Ant Pruitt (02:33:14):
Really? Sir,

Leo Laporte (02:33:15):
There's more.

Ant Pruitt (02:33:18):
Found my coffee

Leo Laporte (02:33:18):
Machine. Coffee for an, this is a TikTok ant beware. Be prepared. Okay. Alright. Here we go. No music. No music. No music. No musical. Okay. Perfectly do. She says, oh, I love this guy. I

Speaker 10 (02:33:32):
Love this guy. He takes 45 minutes to make a cup of coffee and it's worth it. That's a telescope.

Leo Laporte (02:33:40):
He's using a telescope.

Speaker 10 (02:33:41):
No, it's not.

Ant Pruitt (02:33:43):
It's the scale.

Speaker 10 (02:33:45):
It's the perfect, it's so high tech. Look at that. Everything's perfect. Every step has a purpose.

Leo Laporte (02:33:53):
What's a filter in there?

Speaker 10 (02:33:55):
We don't know the purpose. That's dope. But it has one. I don't that thing had a magnet <laugh>. So cool. Coming mean for $10,000. Does. She's hysterical. I just made that up. I had no idea.

Ant Pruitt (02:34:07):
Oh, that's a flir. That's expensive.

Leo Laporte (02:34:09):
It's a flir.

Speaker 10 (02:34:10):
This is the best part.

Ant Pruitt (02:34:11):
Yeah, that's a oh,

Leo Laporte (02:34:12):
Look at that

Ant Pruitt (02:34:13):
Hat. Espresso machine. You use your own muscle.

Leo Laporte (02:34:17):
Oh, you did by

Stacey Higginbotham (02:34:17):
Hand. Don't. Just supposed to look like, but that looks good.

Leo Laporte (02:34:20):
It looks a little orange to

Stacey Higginbotham (02:34:21):
Be honest. Yeah. I better decant that. I would Oh, I love this.

Leo Laporte (02:34:26):
Hysterical.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:34:27):
He takes 45

Leo Laporte (02:34:28):
Minutes sour though. You know all about, you know all about that. No,

Ant Pruitt (02:34:32):
I know a little. I I have no desire to get, to get a flir I'd rather have a machine like,

Leo Laporte (02:34:37):
Don't

Stacey Higginbotham (02:34:37):
You don't wanna work your biceps or triceps or whatever muscles I

Ant Pruitt (02:34:41):
Get. I get enough work on my biceps, aren't you? Where?

Leo Laporte (02:34:44):
Look at him showing off the guns. <Laugh>. If I had known there was gonna be a gun show, I would've brought my my weapons.

Ant Pruitt (02:34:52):
Nah, dude. These are cannons, no guns. Sorry.

Leo Laporte (02:34:55):
Oh lord. Sorry. <laugh>. So the flare espresso maker Wire cut a nurse gun you to, to, to pull your, pull your espresso yourself. Look at that. Yep. It's like a pomegranate squeezer. Only it's espresso. Is it better that way?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:35:13):
Never. Isn't

Leo Laporte (02:35:14):
That better that way? I mean, why don't I let the machine do it?

Ant Pruitt (02:35:19):
I guess. Sometimes the machine can be inconsistent,

Leo Laporte (02:35:22):
But I mean, this has

Ant Pruitt (02:35:23):
A little, it could be consistent with the flare.

Leo Laporte (02:35:25):
I'm inconsistent. I'm too weak to do it.

Ant Pruitt (02:35:28):
If your grind ain't right, you won't get the right pressure either.

Leo Laporte (02:35:32):
Oh. So that's true. And then it shows you pressure.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:35:34):
Didn't know there was a pomegranate juicer, y'all.

Leo Laporte (02:35:37):
Oh yeah. <Laugh>. We have one at home. They're amazing. Of course you do. We saw one in Turkey. We were in Istanbul, by the way. Thoughts of prayers. Love to everybody in Turkey. What a terrible, terrible thing,

Ant Pruitt (02:35:50):
Right? Indeed.

Leo Laporte (02:35:51):
But we were how do you, in Istanbul and all over Istanbul, there's guys with big carts of beautiful red pomegranates and those giant squeezers and they cut it in half. It's good.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:36:05):
Oh

Leo Laporte (02:36:06):
My God. It's, it'll also ju it'll also do you know, juice oranges. If

Stacey Higginbotham (02:36:11):
You I need this. Oh my god. It's $250. Well,

Ant Pruitt (02:36:14):
So nope. You don't need it. <Laugh>

Leo Laporte (02:36:16):
Costs more. Buy

Ant Pruitt (02:36:18):
Some palm. Clearly

Stacey Higginbotham (02:36:21):
<Laugh>. I can just buy the palm. Wonderful. In the store. <Laugh>. Oh, here's one for 70.

Leo Laporte (02:36:30):
Yeah. I don't think we spent that much on ours. Ours is just some cast iron thing. I mean, it's not, but it's great. It's, it's got. It's a long enough. When was the last time you used it, Leo? All the time. I use it every time I make piccata because I'll put a lemon in there. It's a great way to juice a lemon. And Lisa,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:36:47):
I a citrus juicer.

Leo Laporte (02:36:48):
No, this is better. This is not one of those things. You go, this is not that. This is like,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:36:54):
No, I have a hand squeezer for my citrus. Oh, you could use that. I use it for making cocktails. Will

Leo Laporte (02:36:59):
You get this? Can use your hands, hands. Trust me. Wait till you get this. It's a whole different ballgame.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:37:07):
<Laugh> just haven't, okay. All right. Surprised I've totally derailed this

Leo Laporte (02:37:14):
Show. I'm surprised you don't have

Stacey Higginbotham (02:37:15):
Have that. I don't even, I don't even know what's happening anymore. <Laugh>, we talk

Leo Laporte (02:37:19):
About baseball pop. If you had a, if you had a choice between, oh, it's $575 and you, and you know, and it's not even a length.

Ant Pruitt (02:37:27):
Right? And you use your own muscle damn net. Nope.

Leo Laporte (02:37:30):
With that, that's

Ant Pruitt (02:37:31):
Pretty, give me a double boiler. Give me the one that's there at 1351 Sweet B. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (02:37:38):
Redwood Way. You like that one? <Laugh>?

Ant Pruitt (02:37:39):
Yeah. That

Leo Laporte (02:37:40):
Works. Well, if I ever get a flare, I'll give you the the Dre <laugh>.

Jeff Jarvis (02:37:43):
Well, that doesn't even have all the stuff we saw in the video.

Leo Laporte (02:37:47):
It does require,

Ant Pruitt (02:37:48):
It doesn't need all that

Leo Laporte (02:37:49):
A hike. I don't need all that espresso capable Berg. Grindr like the flare. I

Ant Pruitt (02:37:52):
Have a, I have a decent grinder. I have a decent conical bird grind. Yeah,

Leo Laporte (02:37:57):
As long as you get the conical bur baby. Oh, look, you can get the Flare 58 valve plunger upgrade kit for a mere $40.

Leo Laporte (02:38:06):
There's a deal, sir. Look at they have a hand grinder too. <Laugh>, maybe they just, I have a

Ant Pruitt (02:38:12):
Hand grinder for emergency. Yeah,

Leo Laporte (02:38:14):
They

Ant Pruitt (02:38:14):
Just, that's not for a $700

Leo Laporte (02:38:16):
Though. You just don't wanna I don't, I'm not. Yeah. What if it's no power? You know, how are you gonna get your shot?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:38:22):
You no power. This is what you need. No,

Ant Pruitt (02:38:25):
With the, with my hand Grindr. I take my my little drill, power drill and just put

Leo Laporte (02:38:33):
It on. That's smart. That's smart. Fixes it up. Let the

Ant Pruitt (02:38:37):
Drill, drill it. Just in case my grinder breaks. I have a hand grinder to

Leo Laporte (02:38:40):
I'm giving up coffee. You know what? I'm gonna start drinking and you're gonna see me doing this. I'm gonna drink. I'm a granite juice Herba matte. I'm gonna start drinking.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:38:49):
Oh,

Leo Laporte (02:38:49):
Guba. Yeah. Ma, I'm gonna start drinking. I got the little cup, the little silver bombilla straw.

Jeff Jarvis (02:38:56):
What was the movie where the, where the, the bad guy drank that all the time.

Leo Laporte (02:38:59):
Yeah. It's really creepy because, and I saw this when I was in Uruguay. These guys walk around the whole time holding this cup, and every once in a while they go and some of them have straps around the next to hold the cup. Some of them have straps around the next to hold the cup and another strap around the shoulder to hold a thermos of hot water so they could pour more water into the Gord. And it's a whole thing. And boy, don't ever stir your mate, mate. Apparently that's considered a no-no. So I am gonna be that effe kind of Dr. Evil guy with my little

Ant Pruitt (02:39:29):
Day.

Leo Laporte (02:39:30):
I learn of Matta.

Jeff Jarvis (02:39:31):
Is it caffeine?

Leo Laporte (02:39:32):
Hi caffeine. It

Stacey Higginbotham (02:39:33):
Does have caffeine.

Leo Laporte (02:39:34):
Yeah. Hi caffeine.

Jeff Jarvis (02:39:36):
Not of that.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:39:37):
Or you could just do Coke

Leo Laporte (02:39:39):
<Laugh> options.

Ant Pruitt (02:39:40):
Coca-Cola. Coca-Cola

Leo Laporte (02:39:42):
Co. Cola.

Ant Pruitt (02:39:43):
Where do

Leo Laporte (02:39:43):
I get that? Co Cola. No, she, she

Ant Pruitt (02:39:45):
Said you could just do Coke's,

Leo Laporte (02:39:47):
Coke, adding Coke's, cocaine, lowercase.

Ant Pruitt (02:39:49):
Let's clarify.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:39:51):
I'm, I'm, I'm, I mean, if you're gonna get that kind of caffeine and you're just gonna sip on it all day, I mean, I'm

Jeff Jarvis (02:39:56):
Not, did you see Tom Hanks invention of cocaine? You see

Leo Laporte (02:39:59):
This?

Jeff Jarvis (02:40:01):
He was on, I think one of late night shows and accidentally he had a Coke and somebody poured champagne into it. A Diet Coke and champagne.

Leo Laporte (02:40:12):
And it's a whole shtick now. How it's really good. And people are making videos telling Tom Hanks, oh Tom, this is great. He calls it, there you go. Cocaine with A A A G N E <laugh>. And yes, here's from taste of home.com. We tried, you tried Tom Hanks Champaign Diet, Coke Cocktail. And it's the real thing. This is called, that is not the royal,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:40:36):
That is Prosecco.

Leo Laporte (02:40:37):
Yeah. That's not even champagne. But what you do, and my wife does it, is you get a little casis and you put a little dab of casis in the bottom and you pour the champagne on top. That's a kill royal. And a Kiir Royal has is the best drink ever.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:40:54):
You know what, if you take it, take your cure royale and add just a dollop of pomegranate juice. Ooh, it

Leo Laporte (02:41:00):
Is. But only if you have also giant squeezer.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:41:04):
<Laugh>. I'm just letting you know that, that

Leo Laporte (02:41:05):
I shall, that is what I

Stacey Higginbotham (02:41:06):
Used my palm. Wonderful. Four. I

Leo Laporte (02:41:08):
Shall tell Lisa that, that does sound like, cuz it's a little tart. A little sweet. Yeah, a little bubbly. Yeah. Forget dry February. Thank you, Jeff. Oh, it's a royal <laugh>. Geez. Now it's champagne. That's not, it's a royal

Stacey Higginbotham (02:41:24):
Drinking squeeze.

Leo Laporte (02:41:25):
It's not drinking. It's not, it's not Ant. Your pick of the week, sir.

Ant Pruitt (02:41:32):
My pick of the week is some pretty outstanding images that have been uploaded to a photo contest hosted by View Bugs View. Buggs is a service that I mentioned on my show not too long ago because they had something that I thought was controversial, but they reached out and said, Hey, you wanna judge our next contest? I said,

Leo Laporte (02:41:50):
Sure. Oh, you're gonna be a judge.

Ant Pruitt (02:41:52):
I would judge the contest and the winner will get some things, including one of my presets and the images in there. Scroll at to the

Leo Laporte (02:42:00):
Top. Look, I know that guy.

Ant Pruitt (02:42:02):
Yeah, that looks like me.

Leo Laporte (02:42:03):
Oh,

Ant Pruitt (02:42:04):
Nice. If you scroll to the top and click on photos, the photos are beautiful. Not there. And I submit

Leo Laporte (02:42:09):
Not These are ones that have already been submitted. These are the ones you

Ant Pruitt (02:42:12):
Have to choose roughly 10,000. So far. About 10,000 entries have been in there. And they're gonna call through a lot of 'em.

Leo Laporte (02:42:21):
Gee,

Ant Pruitt (02:42:21):
Then get,

Leo Laporte (02:42:22):
Get that to me. How do you pick the, obviously a lot of real pros are on this site. Holy comely.

Ant Pruitt (02:42:29):
Really, really nice stuff. Oh, these are, well, this the theme, the the contest is the morning missed. Yeah. And, and just, you know, how can you capture that? And so look at, they had

Leo Laporte (02:42:40):
To go all the way to New Guinea to get that picture. Chrome <laugh>. This is amazing. Oh, look at these. Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (02:42:47):
Very nice. There's so many good ones in there.

Leo Laporte (02:42:49):
Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (02:42:51):
But I'm glad they're gonna do. How do

Leo Laporte (02:42:52):
You get a lion heavy lifting? You gotta get up early in the morning to get a lions snorting in the cold. You just

Stacey Higginbotham (02:42:58):
Can't be lying around.

Leo Laporte (02:43:00):
Oh, you can't. I'm bug.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:43:03):
It's just gonna get worse from here.

Leo Laporte (02:43:05):
<Laugh> com

Ant Pruitt (02:43:07):
View bug.com

Leo Laporte (02:43:08):
And some nice prizes. And this, you can influence the judge because he's ant

Ant Pruitt (02:43:15):
No comment.

Leo Laporte (02:43:16):
<Laugh> <laugh>. Oh, Ant.

Ant Pruitt (02:43:19):
No comment. Nice. Yeah, but go check that out.

Leo Laporte (02:43:22):
I will. That's cool. Good for you. That's great.

Ant Pruitt (02:43:25):
And I want to give a shout out to a loyal TWiG listener, Mr. Tarell Woods. Tarell Sea Woods. Just, he has been in my brain and I said, do you know what? I'm gonna mention him cuz I know he listens to the show and he actually reaches out over social media. Well, he has some funny stuff. He's a good sport photographer and he's a damn good photographer.

Leo Laporte (02:43:44):
Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (02:43:45):
Damn. Good photographer. So shout out to you. He's action Shots. Mr. Tarell. Nice show shot. He's down there in southern California, USC shooting a lot of sports with, with those folks there at the university. He's a good dude. Nice. And a great photographer.

Leo Laporte (02:44:00):
All right. I'll follow 'em right now.

Ant Pruitt (02:44:03):
And fall. Asley. Of course, I have to mention my family because some people just love me talking about my family. I

Leo Laporte (02:44:11):
Do. Those that

Ant Pruitt (02:44:11):
Don't. I love it. Even those that don't, I'm still gonna talk about 'em. If you check out the thread there ranch, Okta High School athletics features said Hardhead because this past weekend he was competing in these spoken word and poetry out loud competition. Oh. And won county. So he will be going to, whoa. The state.

Leo Laporte (02:44:38):
This is like, is this like couple weeks? Is this like what do they call that? Beat poetry when you

Ant Pruitt (02:44:44):
Spoken Word and he had to act out some stuff and he did pretty good. I told him, oh, that's, his mother's a better actor, but he still did pretty good.

Leo Laporte (02:44:52):
Oh, that's really neat. What was his his, was it, do you call it a poem? What do you, what was his

Ant Pruitt (02:44:57):
Speech? I cannot remember it. It was a poem, but I, but I do not remember.

Leo Laporte (02:45:01):
Well, it wasn't about you obviously,

Ant Pruitt (02:45:03):
So No, it wasn't no <laugh>.

Leo Laporte (02:45:05):
Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (02:45:06):
Nice. Because he, if it was about me, he definitely would've lost

Leo Laporte (02:45:10):
<Laugh>. My dad Ant is so cool

Ant Pruitt (02:45:14):
And gets on my nerves

Leo Laporte (02:45:16):
Coffee before I go to school. <Laugh> <laugh>. That's all. That's all I got. Ant. I still wish we Congratulations. Sing our

Ant Pruitt (02:45:24):
Google

Jeff Jarvis (02:45:24):
Theme. Our Google song.

Leo Laporte (02:45:27):
Still pissed. Wait, wasn't there an AI music generator?

Ant Pruitt (02:45:31):
There was. We couldn't use

Jeff Jarvis (02:45:33):
It. Yeah. Last week we did it. She couldn't use it. It was only a demo.

Leo Laporte (02:45:36):
Well get on it. And it was terrible. It wasn't good. <Laugh>. That wasn't,

Ant Pruitt (02:45:40):
That Discord is much better.

Leo Laporte (02:45:42):
All right, let me go to, this is sound draw.io. Royalty free music, AI generated for you. Create music. Select the theme. Are we angry? Are we dark? Are we dreamy? Are we elegant? Are we glamorous? We're funny and weird. Are we hungry?

Ant Pruitt (02:45:59):
There we go. Oh, definitely. Weird, funny and weird.

Leo Laporte (02:46:01):
It's now creating some funny and weird music. And then we could just use this as our theme. Are you ready? You get to choose. We got a variety of choices here. Funny and weird. Which one do you want? Oh, you could choose the energy level as well.

Jeff Jarvis (02:46:16):
I feel like we're high energy.

Ant Pruitt (02:46:18):
Yeah. It needs to be about

Jeff Jarvis (02:46:19):
A not very high,

Leo Laporte (02:46:20):
Just high

Ant Pruitt (02:46:21):
90 meters. Just high. 90 beats per minute.

Leo Laporte (02:46:24):
90. Okay. We can turn that down. Or just go to a 90. Let's go to a 90 and choose high. Oh. It's all messed up. It's not an option here. How do I play it?

Jeff Jarvis (02:46:35):
<Laugh>? Yeah. There you go.

Ant Pruitt (02:46:38):
Nope.

Jeff Jarvis (02:46:40):
Nope. It's a

Leo Laporte (02:46:40):
Very slow start.

Ant Pruitt (02:46:41):
<Laugh> look at Stacey

Jeff Jarvis (02:46:43):
<Laugh>. Oh God. The audience is leaving. <Laugh> Stacey's headache Must be over. Hey.

Leo Laporte (02:46:49):
Welcome to another episode of

Jeff Jarvis (02:46:51):
This Week in Google. Felt good. This is terrible. But it's better than,

Ant Pruitt (02:46:55):
But it ain't, it ain't us <laugh>. It ain't us though.

Jeff Jarvis (02:46:59):
No, you're ready. Hello

Leo Laporte (02:46:59):
Everybody, and welcome to This Week in Google.

Jeff Jarvis (02:47:07):
Next

Leo Laporte (02:47:08):
On this week at Google,

Jeff Jarvis (02:47:09):
The TikTok video of the week. You know what we need? We need lyrics about Google. That's what we need. Well, we got the

Leo Laporte (02:47:17):
Music, we got the lyrics. Let's just meld them together. Yeah. All right. That's not so good. How about

Ant Pruitt (02:47:24):
Funk You chain Rick

Leo Laporte (02:47:26):
Funk

Jeff Jarvis (02:47:26):
Pop. Hey baby. Are you hip? Are you with it? Are you cool?

Leo Laporte (02:47:32):
Are you ready for this

Jeff Jarvis (02:47:34):
Week?

Ant Pruitt (02:47:34):
It's time for TWiG.

Jeff Jarvis (02:47:38):
<Laugh>.

Ant Pruitt (02:47:39):
Sit down, grab your flash, drives your pixels. Let's talk about Dev Life Baby.

Jeff Jarvis (02:47:48):
End as

Ant Pruitt (02:47:49):
DJ

Jeff Jarvis (02:47:50):
<Laugh>.

Leo Laporte (02:47:52):
All right, next one's DJ

Jeff Jarvis (02:47:53):
Country.

Leo Laporte (02:47:54):
I think our our Austin, Texas contributor ought to do this one. Sing a song with this song.

Jeff Jarvis (02:47:59):
<Laugh>. It's like children's music. Tony Land

Ant Pruitt (02:48:07):
From Nickelodeon.

Jeff Jarvis (02:48:07):
Sing like the band. Here we go. Join in it's time for this week. And <laugh>, were you a music dj? Music. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. How were you in talking up the record? I was good at that. We got, we got four minutes left before we hit our three hour mark. Oh crap. Oops. <laugh>. Well, that means we're gonna keep going. Make sure we hit

Leo Laporte (02:48:35):
Strings.

(02:48:37):
Thanks for joining us, everybody. We do This Week in Google every Wednesday, right? It's supposed to be 2:00 PM Pacific, 5:00 PM Eastern, 2200 utc. Tune in live. You're gonna see what you see. Sometimes it's scary. Don't tell the kids it is This Week in Google. If you wanna watch Live, live TWI tv chat at irc twi TV club. Twit members chat in the club. Twit Discord a Pie The way I didn't mention Club TWiT, but we got some events coming up tomorrow. Hello. When Dao is gonna join us for a fireside chat. She's the host of all about Android. Daniel Suarez on Friday, talking about his new book critical Mass. Really Good. Daniel is a big space advocate. We'll talk to him about how he's gonna save the world through space. Sam will Sam, our car guy. March 2nd. Stacey's book Club. Sea of Tranquility is the novel of the month next April. Victor Bona, one of our editors in April. That's just some of the many events that go on

Jeff Jarvis (02:49:35):
<Laugh>

Leo Laporte (02:49:37):
In our club. You can always chat too about the show. In our Discord. You can get ad free versions of everything we do. Everything we do. All you have to do is you know, join the club and we'll give you a a u r url. It's just for you. With all the ads taken out, there's also shows we don't put out anywhere else, like hands on Macintosh, hands on Windows on Title Lennox show. I think it's just great. I, it to me is the best place to hang ever. It helps us continue to do what we do. I hope you enjoy it. And if you do, join the club. Twit tv slash club TWiT <laugh>. No. And there's Snoop singing our new song. I'm excited. I'm very excited. <Laugh>. It's gonna be good. It's gonna be good. <Laugh>. Thank you. Stacey Higginbotham. You'll fight her at Stacey on i ot.com. Sign up for a newsletter. It's free. And of course, listen to the great podcast with Kevin Tofu. Thank you. Jeff Jarvis. He is the director of the Town Night Center for Entrepreneurial Journalism at the Craig Numar

Speaker 11 (02:50:42):
<Laugh>

Jeff Jarvis (02:50:45):
Graduate School of Journalism. Craig's pigeons at the City, university of New York,

Leo Laporte (02:50:51):
By the way. No pigeons were harmed in the making of this show. Craig. we also thank Ant Pruit Hands Off Photography, Twitter tv slash hop. He's also our community manager in Club Twi. That's why it's so much fun.

Jeff Jarvis (02:51:03):
Who Google Craig Newmark pigeons. Just one second. There's a farewell,

Leo Laporte (02:51:06):
There's a reason. Doesn't he have a website that's dedicated

Jeff Jarvis (02:51:10):
To Well, just, just Google Craig Newmark pigeons. And the images are right there. They're very sweet. Oh, you can't Google it because you don't have,

Leo Laporte (02:51:17):
I don't Google it, but I do have pigeons.

Jeff Jarvis (02:51:19):
Oh, us Neva. The pictures aren't as good. Well, there's Craig and Pigeons. Yes. Outstanding. That's not Craig in the pigeon. That

Leo Laporte (02:51:26):
Is, does he invite them in from like,

Jeff Jarvis (02:51:29):
There's a, there's a pigeon rescue place and they, they come and they bring him in? No, no, he doesn't do this. He has bird feeders and bird stuff. And he loves birds of all kinds. But the pigeon pigeon, he doing pigeon entrapment.

Leo Laporte (02:51:40):
No <laugh>. He's pigeon pigeon rescue.org. He doesn't entrap them. He rescues them.

Jeff Jarvis (02:51:51):
Jammer B, you are so awesome. Got two, three. So awesome. Too crazy. All right, now you can say goodbye. Thank you everybody.

Leo Laporte (02:51:59):
Have a great night. We'll see you next time on TWiG. Bye-Bye.

Jeff Jarvis (02:52:04):
If you love all

Speaker 12 (02:52:04):
Things Android, well, I've got a show for you to check out. It's called All About Android. And I'll give you three guesses. What we talk about, we talk about Android, the latest news, hardware, apps, we answer feedback. It's me, Jason Howell, Ron Richards Huyen Tue Dao and a whole cast of awesome characters talking about the operating system that we love. You can find all about Android at TWiT.tv/aaa.