This Week in Google 726, Transcript

Please be advised this transcript is AI-generated and may not be word for word. Time codes refer to the approximate times in the ad-supported version of the show.

Leo Laporte (00:00:00):
It's time for Twig this week in Google. Stacey's here s here. And look who's in studio with us. Jeff Jarvis. We'll talk about Google's quarterly results that just came out. Surprise, surprise, surprise. It's a profit thing. We'll also talk about where Ruth Porat is going. And Jeff went to Google yesterday to learn about the new journal Lmm. We're gonna find out what's it called? Notebook Lmm. We're gonna find out all about notebook lmm, and I'm gonna learn what it's called next on this week in Google. The show is brought to you by Cisco Meraki. Without a cloud managed network, businesses inevitably fall behind. Experience, the ease and efficiency of Meraki's single platform to elevate the place where your employees and customers come together. Cisco Meraki maximizes uptime and minimizes loss to digitally transform your organization, Meraki's intuitive interface, increased connectivity and multi-site management. Keep your organization operating seamlessly and securely wherever your team is. Let's Cisco Meraki's 24 7. Available support. Help your organizations remote, onsite, and hybrid teams always do their best work. Visit meraki.cisco.com/twit.

Speaker 2 (00:01:20):
Podcasts you love From people you trust. This is twit.

Leo Laporte (00:01:29):
This is Twig this week in Google. Episode 726 recorded Wednesday, July 26th. 2023. Corpora, bailiwick, and Jones. This weekend, Google is brought to you by discourse. The online home for your community discourse makes it easy to have meaningful conversations and collaborate anytime anywhere. Visit discourse.org/twi to get one month free on all self-serve plans. And buy a WSS Insiders podcast. Search for AWS Insiders in your podcast player. Or visit cloud fix.oria.com/podcast. We'll also include a link in the show notes. And our thanks to AWS Insiders for their support. And buy fast mail, reclaim your privacy, boost productivity, make email yours with FastMail. Try it now free for 30 days at fastmail.com/twit. It's time for Twig. This week in Google the show, we cover the latest news from Google far, far away in the distant land of Bainbridge lives. A woman named Stacy, who is today the only person on Zoom. Do you see Stacey sad? All of us? Or do you see, see yourself?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:02:56):
I pin the other thing, but

Leo Laporte (00:02:58):
Today I just see me. Yeah. 'cause they're not on Zoom. I'm sorry, Stacy.

Jeff Jarvis (00:03:04):
Oh, that's

Leo Laporte (00:03:05):
Right. It's nice to see you and, oh, well now I won't know when I can run to the bathroom. You don't know when you can go to the bathroom, because we're all here and you and I not, but we will know also in the studio with me. Mr. Ant. Pruitt. Good to see you ant our, our wonderful community manager manager, <laugh>. I told you I was gonna be tired. Oh man. I had the Pappy Van Winkle last night. <Laugh> our wonderful community manager for club Twit. Good to see you. Hello, sir. And in studio with us, because he just gave his big lecture at the Commonwealth Club in San Francisco. The author of the Gutenberg parenthesis, the Age of Print, and its lessons for the Age of the Internet. Jeff Jarvis is so good to see

Jeff Jarvis (00:03:46):
You. It is so good to be here. Really is. And, and I, I risked

Leo Laporte (00:03:51):
Craig the

Jeff Jarvis (00:03:52):
Guns. Greg, Greg

Leo Laporte (00:03:54):
Gets his plug no matter what.

Jeff Jarvis (00:03:55):
I jump, I I risked life and limb to come here. I drove over, took the bridge. I drove over the bridge. Did you

Leo Laporte (00:03:59):
Drove over it? Did you close your eyes when the driver

Jeff Jarvis (00:04:02):
I was happy that it was foggy.

Leo Laporte (00:04:04):
Yeah. Wow.

Jeff Jarvis (00:04:04):
Yeah. That made me happy. 'cause I can't, can't see. Yeah. Actually, what's

Leo Laporte (00:04:07):
Going on, by the way. That's, that's exactly what you don't want. 'cause If you can't see it either can the other driver. So <laugh>, I Yeah, I'm just saying

Jeff Jarvis (00:04:17):
Minor detail. I did, I did feel a little faint. Halfway across.

Leo Laporte (00:04:20):
Oh, I'm sorry. Yeah. Jeff ever since nine 11 mm-hmm. <Affirmative> has had a kind of a phobia of crossing bridges, understandably. Especially

Jeff Jarvis (00:04:28):
Suspension bridges.

Leo Laporte (00:04:29):
Yeah. Understandably. Yeah. Jeff was in New York City, was on the Zi Path train. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> when the towers went down in New York City. Yep. And, and you came outta the path into a, into the path of a lot of dust and debris. Once,

Jeff Jarvis (00:04:44):
Once the number two fell. Yeah. I was, I was in, I know that I was in the last path train as the first jet hit. Wow. I was across the street when the second jet hit. Oh my

Leo Laporte (00:04:54):
Gosh.

Jeff Jarvis (00:04:54):
And then I was a block away from the South Tower when it came down. Mm-Hmm. Man, horrible. Did not know that my wife remains angry with me to this day that I didn't get the hell out of there.

Leo Laporte (00:05:02):
You watched, you're a journalist. I'm a journalist. You watched, you're a journalist. You run

Jeff Jarvis (00:05:06):
Into the Yeah, yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:05:07):
Yeah. I tell you, I've told this before, but going to the nine 11 museum there where the Path train is. Yes. You know where the old station was? How was

Jeff Jarvis (00:05:18):
It? I've not had the courage to

Leo Laporte (00:05:19):
Go. Yep. I'm, I was bawling my eyes out because for that very reason, you see the, where the first responders are running in as everybody's running out. Yes. And there's a melted fire truck at the, at the entrance to the museum. I mean, a truck that was mm-hmm. <Affirmative> just melt, melted from the heat. I mean, it's just yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (00:05:36):
It's, I remember the faces of them going into the tower and they knew what I was too stupid to know. They knew what they were going into. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:05:46):
Anyway, anyway, good to have you here. Thank you for your

Jeff Jarvis (00:05:49):
Phia survived that and the bridge

Leo Laporte (00:05:51):
<Laugh>. I now have a fear of the letter X <laugh>. Oh boy.

Jeff Jarvis (00:05:55):
Oh

Leo Laporte (00:05:56):
Boy. What The rickety hawk is going on over there on the Twitter. It is now x.com. How much did he pay for that domain? Not enough. Because Microsoft and Facebook both owned the trademark. Ha <laugh> <laugh>. And apparently they didn't bother. They didn't they, because I think, and this is Elon to a t in his mind, he invented X because back before PayPal mm-hmm. His company was x.com. Right. He's owned x.com ever since they merged with PayPal. And it was his goal at the time to take Finity, which is the company that was run by Peter Thiel and Max Lev Chin merged with x.com. And they named the merged company's PayPal. But, but even then, Elon wanted to make the everything app. He said, it's a trillion dollar idea. I'm gonna call it x.com and Lev Chin. And Teal basically forced him out 'cause he was nuts.

(00:06:55):
Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And he, and if, if they think you're not <laugh> <laugh>, they, they said, no, no, no, no, no. We're not gonna do the everything company. We're gonna do PayPal. Which straight out be the right thing. Yeah. and so he's always wanted to do this. And I'm sure in his mind he thinks, well, I thought of this in 2000. So it's mine. Tough nuggies. That's not how it works, unfortunately. He's already banned in what is it, SSRI Lanka or Malaysia. Because you can't have a company with the word name X in the, in the company. Oh, wow. It's an anti porn restriction. It's bizarre because Advertis is there. Huh. If you go to x.com and redirect you still to twitter.com, but they did rename some Twitter things to X It's a very weird ill planned conversion. So

Stacey Higginbotham (00:07:45):
It's like, if you let high school students be in charge Yeah. Of a branding exercise. I mean, that is what it's like. It's like letting just someone your intern take care of renaming the company. It's

Leo Laporte (00:07:56):
The high school students who are in detention. He he had, and you probably saw the video he had scissor trucks come out to start taking down the Twitter from the front of the building. But it turns out he didn't get a permit because again, I'm Elon Musk. I don't have to. And the police stopped him after they got t w I t T down. So just in the front it said, er, emergency response. Er, I, I presume by now it's all down. But it's, that's, this is Elon Musk in a nutshell. He's not a planner. Ain't trouble Beloved brand. What

Ant Pruitt (00:08:34):
If it wasn't necessarily about planning? What if it was, I can do whatever the hell I

Leo Laporte (00:08:38):
Want? Well, it is. Right. You know, let

Ant Pruitt (00:08:40):
Just take these letters

Leo Laporte (00:08:41):
Down. Literally. That's what it is. I don't, there rules don't apply to me. He's famous for, and, and Linda Yao, the new c e o kind of kissed his ring when she sent out her first memo saying, we're gonna do this all from first principles. This is what Elon Stan say is his secret recipe for genius, is instead of taking as given what people tell him, he says, we're gonna break it down and we're gonna start at first principles. Which it does. That's not what that means. What he really is saying is, no, we're gonna don it doesn't matter what you say. It doesn't matter.

Jeff Jarvis (00:09:16):
I'm so sad. 'cause I had the little, the, what they called the ears from the browser, the, the things, the little things there. I had the tabs.

Leo Laporte (00:09:22):
Well,

Jeff Jarvis (00:09:23):
No, but the things, no,

Ant Pruitt (00:09:24):
The little gran

Jeff Jarvis (00:09:24):
Guitar, the little icons, the, there's a name for it. Yeah. What Navon. Thank you. Navon. So I still had the birds until this morning.

Leo Laporte (00:09:30):
And the birds are gone now. The birds are

Jeff Jarvis (00:09:32):
Gone now. Yeah. I also, there, there was one argument online that we should do you call it a, a, a tweet. A Ttt <laugh>. And I said, that sounds like al leakage. It's a t a fart t Yeah. No, and

Leo Laporte (00:09:45):
There's all sorts of things that if you had, you know, spent five minutes thinking about, you would've said, oh, well, you know, we, maybe we should plan this. Just threw it in the air.

Ant Pruitt (00:09:55):
Has there been any speculation on what this whole rebranding attempt is supposed to be about? Because I remember part of the whole acquisition that he sort of kicked and dragged his feet on, is he, he didn't like the brand of Twitter. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> and wanted to get in and cling things up, yada, yada, yada. And

Leo Laporte (00:10:13):
He did say very early on, I wanna make it the everything. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> site. I want it to do payment. But, you know, that's like saying I want to be a billionaire. Okay. But there's, you know, there's a few steps. Here's still

Ant Pruitt (00:10:25):
Some work along the way. There's still

Jeff Jarvis (00:10:26):
Some work.

Leo Laporte (00:10:30):
I think I just, it's, and it's, we are, we live in interesting times. It's unaccountable. It's just, here's a guy who has so much money. I mean, big deal. He's, he's worth so much that even losing it won't be 44 billion. 'cause He borrowed 13 billion from the bank. So even losing $31 billion of his own money, it's not a big deal.

Jeff Jarvis (00:10:50):
You know what's driving me crazy now is that when Trump was in office, the media would take every single tweet of his and write an entire news story about it. It was easy. And now they're doing that with Musk.

Ant Pruitt (00:11:00):
Yeah. It is easy.

Jeff Jarvis (00:11:01):
Yeah. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:11:03):
Drives

Ant Pruitt (00:11:04):
Me nuts. His, his new c e o. So she's basically just been a bit of a puppet. Not necessarily.

Leo Laporte (00:11:09):
Oh, yeah. Oh. She's just all going along with, in fact, what was her tweet? <Laugh>? She, I gotta read this. 'cause It was just so when, when it happened on Sunday, happened over the weekend. And she tweeted kind of, I guess her vision for the future of, of Twitter. I have to get through all the retweets of Elon. Look at, they have a big X on the headquarters tonight. That's,

Ant Pruitt (00:11:38):
Yeah. So that's all she's doing. Just amplifying his message.

Leo Laporte (00:11:41):
That's great. So here's here's God, it's just, it's it's business doublespeak, if I can find it.

Ant Pruitt (00:11:55):
Bunch of platitudes.

Leo Laporte (00:11:56):
Yeah. Oh yeah. I love those. Yeah. I love those

Ant Pruitt (00:11:59):
Meetings.

Leo Laporte (00:12:00):
<Laugh>. Yeah. It's

Ant Pruitt (00:12:03):
Really, come on.

Leo Laporte (00:12:04):
It's a exceedingly rare thing in life for business that you get a second chance to make another big impression. Twitter made one massive impression and change the way we communicate. Now, X will go further. Oh, trans transforming the global town square. Okay. She could have

Ant Pruitt (00:12:20):
Stopped right there, and I'd have been fine with that.

Leo Laporte (00:12:22):
Yeah. Still be there for years. Fans and critics alike have pushed Twitter to a dream bigger, to innovate faster, to fulfill the great potential. X will do that and more. We've already started to see X take shape over the past eight months through our rapid feature launches. But we're just getting started. X will be the platform that can deliver. Well, everything Elon Musk and I are looking forward to working with our teams, and every single one of our partners bring X to the world.

Ant Pruitt (00:12:49):
I don't think she respects him. She didn't say Mr.

Leo Laporte (00:12:52):
Mr. Musk. You would say, Mr. Musk,

Ant Pruitt (00:12:55):
If I respect you, if,

Leo Laporte (00:12:56):
Yeah. Oh, that's good to know. <Laugh>, you. You don't call me Mr. Laporte. Do you? <Laugh>. I, you know, it's just,

Ant Pruitt (00:13:07):
Of course, Mr. Laport,

Leo Laporte (00:13:09):
It's <laugh>. Just bizarre. What's going on over there? I don't know. I don't know what to, what to say. I don't have a,

Ant Pruitt (00:13:17):
I this is with rebranding. That's, that seems to be a, I

Leo Laporte (00:13:20):
Do, if you have a brand that's really well known,

Ant Pruitt (00:13:23):
If it's really well known for, for bad stuff,

Leo Laporte (00:13:26):
You think that

Ant Pruitt (00:13:27):
Twitter mean, considering everybody was leaving Twitter because of its brand of, of, of being a troll farm and, and misinformation and so forth.

Leo Laporte (00:13:35):
I, no, I would say they were leaving Twitter because it was a troll farm. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But the brand was somewhat intact. I think they left with some regret. And there are a lot of people mm-hmm. <Affirmative> who stayed because it's Twitter.

Ant Pruitt (00:13:44):
Yeah. 'cause it's Twitter.

Leo Laporte (00:13:45):
Yeah. And I've heard a number of people say over on Threads, <laugh> that of all the things that Elon did, this was the one that hurt the most. Yeah. This is the one where there's, where it's really like, yeah, I guess it's over. Yeah. Okay. But, but

Jeff Jarvis (00:13:59):
There was a great essay. I put it in the rundown a couple weeks ago by Andre Brock Jr. Who I quote often on the show, who talking about black Twitter said, I'm not leaving. I'm still not leaving, still have an investment in this. Right. Still created something here that we couldn't have created elsewhere.

Leo Laporte (00:14:16):
Okay. So it's not, it's not for everybody. If you say so

Ant Pruitt (00:14:20):
Threads, what are your, you you still hanging in there with threads?

Leo Laporte (00:14:23):
I like th threads and Blue Sky both have promise. Yes. Mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, you know, when we had we were talking about threads with Dan Patterson, who was like, almost shaky saying, but Meta is among the worst companies in the world. This is a company that mm-hmm. <Affirmative> fostered you know mm-hmm. <Affirmative> genocide among the Rohingya that, that, that supported, you know a Junta military, junta and Myanmar. This is not a good company. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And people are, are just hiding that, you know, putting their heads in there, Sam, when they're joining. I remember

Ant Pruitt (00:14:57):
That. That was on

Leo Laporte (00:14:58):
Twit. Yeah, it was on Twit. Because they're, they're pretending it's not meta, you know. Oh, it's, it's not meta. Well, once again, only Musks could make Zuck look good. I know he did too, didn't he? He did. Yeah. Alright, so that's enough. The brand rebranding has happened. A few people on Monday said, oh, he's just joking. He'll go back. And I think it's, I think it's permanent now. Yeah. I think it's but I'm not gonna refer to it as that. You gonna call it Twitter? Still? Always. Always. I have to say, as the owner of the Twit trademark, which preceded the Twitter trademark, I couldn't be happier. Yeah. Lots of point, to be honest. Yeah. I

Ant Pruitt (00:15:35):
Saw someone in our, in our discord, brought up a little, a funny tweet about you and basically saying, Hey, way to go twit tv and play in the long game. <Laugh>

Leo Laporte (00:15:43):
And <laugh>. We hung in there

Ant Pruitt (00:15:46):
And winning the battle.

Leo Laporte (00:15:48):
I remember I mentioned this because, you know, we were up, we were really upset when they named it Twitter. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And I interviewed EV, ev e Williams shortly after. I said, why'd you call it Twitter? Do you, you knew about twit? 'cause You ran audio, which owned twi. He said, yeah, we didn't think, we didn't think either of us were going anywhere. So it was okay, <laugh>. Well, guess what? E look who survived. Look who's still here. Look who's still standing. You were right. <Laugh> the real chief baby. Anyway, t yeah. We we, we, we had a little battle with them over over that mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, Elon, remember he called himself Chief Twit, which was very annoying to me. Now he's Chief X, chief X. That's good. <Laugh>, you be that, that's called, you go be Chief X.

(00:16:33):
Enjoy. Good guys. Bless. More importantly, the Google annual or quarterly results are out. Good Lord. <Laugh>, 79% of their revenue comes from advertising. Is that a surprise? No. Well, it's down from 98%. So they had managed to diversify. Considerable. That's better, right? Yeah. Oh yeah. For 2023, the quarter entering June 30th, revenue was 74 million. That was up 5 million from the year before. Up 7% operating margin is 29%. That's a pretty good margin. That's, that's how much that is profit. Is it going down though? No. It was 28% last quarter. Last year. Over year. Quarter, quarter. And <laugh>, I was like year, year over year, quarter over quarter net income. That's the one we care about. $18 billion in three months. Mm. Mm-hmm. That's pretty good. Although Microsoft, 20 billion in three months, their quarterly results came out today as well. Microsoft made $72 billion in profit last year. Dang. Over the last year. That's a million. Do you want billion a week? <Laugh>?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:17:54):
Do you want some crazy numbers? Yes. Okay. You know, our, our three cloud providers mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, Microsoft Cloud. So they, they basically said they, their earnings, Microsoft Clouds surpassed 110 billion in annual revenue. A w s recorded 80.1 billion in revenue. Oh, that's,

Leo Laporte (00:18:16):
That's interesting, huh.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:18:17):
And ready Google Cloud, and they don't break it out is estimated. Gartner estimates it at 9.1 billion,

Leo Laporte (00:18:26):
One 10th. Mm. One 10th of a w s. Wow. But I'm surprised Azure beat a ws. Yeah. Part of this though is accounting Reg you know, folder all, because Microsoft Bundles, we talked about this on Windows Weekly. They, they put different categories in mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. And it's very hard. They, it's really intentional on all these companies. They, they don't want to be too clear. Oh, there's a way

Jeff Jarvis (00:18:52):
Of cooking the

Stacey Higginbotham (00:18:53):
Books. Well, let me, let me make a quick clarifying, because if we're lumping, Google Cloud in total was 26.3 billion in 2022. A little better. But, but hold on. They clump their infrastructure business, which is what I said was 9.1 billion with the workspace business, which

Leo Laporte (00:19:09):
To me is not clapping. Workspace is what we pay for mm-hmm. <Affirmative>, Google Docs and all that stuff. Ah, so that isn't really, well, I mean, it runs on the cloud. I don't know. Is that their cloud business?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:19:19):
No. I mean, a w s is all, all cloud, like, that's all infrastructure basically. Right. Running out. So that's, that's more apples to apples.

Leo Laporte (00:19:29):
Google Cloud was up according to this, y quarter over quarter, year over year. Considerably 8 billion compared to 6.2 billion last year. This time. Other betts, 2080 5 million up over 193 million at this time. Go

Stacey Higginbotham (00:19:46):
Nest,

Leo Laporte (00:19:47):
<Laugh>, go Nest search is the biggie. Right. And, but advertising is the biggie of the biggie. $58 billion in advertising.

Jeff Jarvis (00:19:55):
And how much of search, search is advertising too.

Leo Laporte (00:19:58):
Yeah. Yeah. Right. Search is advertising is advertising. What's the, what's the revenue search? Let's the revenue there. It's all I'm saying. It's all advertising.

Jeff Jarvis (00:20:05):
You know, I was, I I, I went to Google yesterday morning, saw Steven Johnson and saw the team that did the notebook L Lab, which we can talk about later. But it, it, it occurred to me as I was walking around that Google more and more has become a B two B business.

Leo Laporte (00:20:21):
Yeah. And

Jeff Jarvis (00:20:22):
The B two C

Stacey Higginbotham (00:20:24):
No. Well,

Jeff Jarvis (00:20:24):
Really, I think so we just stay for a second. And I'll tear me down. Stacy, tear me down. Advertising is B two B and a lot of it, it is advertising service to other companies. Right. Hosting research, all those things. The

Leo Laporte (00:20:41):
Bcp Well, and Google is selling advertising to businesses. They're not selling it to individuals. Yes. That's right. That's right. That's what I saw. So, 'cause so Google really is a B two B.

Jeff Jarvis (00:20:49):
Yeah. And, and, and we're

Leo Laporte (00:20:50):
Cool enough, but you use search, consumers use search, but the revenue comes from other businesses. That's what I

Stacey Higginbotham (00:20:56):
Thought. That's, that's why we all say that you're not the customer That's

Leo Laporte (00:21:00):
Right. For

Stacey Higginbotham (00:21:00):
This sort of thing. You're the product. You're the product, you're

Leo Laporte (00:21:01):
The product. Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (00:21:03):
Well, true of B too.

Leo Laporte (00:21:06):
No, they're not the product. You are not our product. You are our friends. <Laugh>.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:21:11):
I don't, I mean, I think, I think the audience like, okay, yeah, we'll

Jeff Jarvis (00:21:18):
Just, well, Stacey, lemme try this. Lemme try this scenario. Make your point. If, if Google were to break up, not that I am in favor of that, I'm not because I don't think it'll accomplish anything. But if they were to break up the presumption in the past is they would get rid of part of the ad business or something like that. What if instead they said, you know, Google and YouTube are consumer facing and we're not very good at that. We kill services all the time. We'll make that a separate company. And Alphabet becomes purely B two B advertising services, advertising, sales all of that. Plus hosting, plus research plus those things. That's what I was just, I was starting to think that I had, I had the notion of Google kind of reversed, where the consumer businesses are there almost as demonstration projects for what has become their real business. That's my point, Stacy.

Leo Laporte (00:22:04):
The

Stacey Higginbotham (00:22:04):
Okay. No, that, that makes sense. Yeah. And I mean, YouTube though is consumer facing, but again, it's a, I think what then it would do is turns Google into, from a tech company to a media company.

Jeff Jarvis (00:22:16):
Media. Yeah. Leo's been saying for a long time that he objects to that lash up. Right?

Leo Laporte (00:22:21):
Yeah. Well, I do want, I do what Google is, is a, is a search engine. But really, honestly, if it's an ad <laugh>, if it's an advertising company, of course it's a media company. You have to have something to put the stick to glue the ad. Yeah. Stick the ads to like a stand

Jeff Jarvis (00:22:36):
Mm-Hmm. <Affirmative> it's billboards.

Leo Laporte (00:22:38):
Yeah. Ad sales Rose 4.4 percent for YouTube in the quarter after

Jeff Jarvis (00:22:44):
I think a couple quarters of down. Yep. So that's a big deal.

Leo Laporte (00:22:46):
Yep. The other big news Ruth Poat, who has been the the slasher has a new job. <Laugh>, she's the one who's as C F O was cutting all of the dead weight, breaking

Jeff Jarvis (00:23:01):
Our hearts at least.

Leo Laporte (00:23:02):
Yeah. I mean, I don't, we don't know how the politics works inside. So maybe yes, maybe no. But she was certainly the, the face of all of that slashing, she will assume the newly created role of president and chief investment officer for Alphabet effective September 1st. She'll continue to be C F O. She's not leaving. Oh, yeah. Oh. Including leading the company's 2024 and long range capital planning

Jeff Jarvis (00:23:29):
Process. I thought, wait, wait, wait. She's for now. I thought and told there's a replacement, is what I read. Somewhere

Leo Laporte (00:23:36):
In her new role, it says, wow, okay, we'll continue to serve as C F O. I'm looking at the Google press release in her new role. Ruth will be responsible for alphabet's investments in its other bets. Did they call her Ruth? Ms. Poat will be responsible for Alphabet. Maybe they don't like her as much. Yeah,

Jeff Jarvis (00:23:53):
I was gonna say, there's a reason <laugh>

Leo Laporte (00:23:55):
<Laugh> will be responsible for alphabet's investments in its other Betts portfolio. Working other Betts is the thing that Ruth Poat has been slowly chopping away at, working closely with Sundar. If I worked at Verily or Waymo, I'd be a little nervous. And the company's investments in countries and communities around the world in her new role said, Sundar phai, Ms. Poat will strengthen our collaboration with policy makers and shape our corporate investments to yada, yada, yada. I'm excited about this new role says Ms. Porat, and they have opportunity to engage with leaders globally to unlock global growth via technology investment.

Jeff Jarvis (00:24:34):
C NBC says you will continue a C F O until Alphabet selects the replacement.

Leo Laporte (00:24:38):
Okay. Okay. But she's going to lead the long range capital planning process for 2024. Oh, well, I, you're right. I missed the rest of the sentence. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, while the company searches for and selects her successor. <Laugh>, you're absolutely right. I, I missed that whole

Jeff Jarvis (00:24:55):
Detail. Second clause. You're just like an L l m Leo. Yeah. <laugh>.

Leo Laporte (00:24:59):
I saw the first

Jeff Jarvis (00:25:00):
Part. Elucidated <laugh>.

Leo Laporte (00:25:02):
Anyway. a good quarter, a ad sales are up. Yeah. YouTube's doing well. Alphabet tops the market's estimates. So I'm sure that's good for the stock market which is good for Google. Right.

Jeff Jarvis (00:25:18):
And, and the diversification is really important. It really was 98% advertising back in the day. So,

Leo Laporte (00:25:25):
Wow. What it takes

Stacey Higginbotham (00:25:27):
Time to, to make, to juggle that tightrope from going from one business to another. Especially one is with such high profit margins.

Jeff Jarvis (00:25:35):
Right. It works.

Leo Laporte (00:25:36):
Flat out works 2 billion logged in monthly users watching YouTube shorts. That's a, that's a success.

Jeff Jarvis (00:25:44):
It always seems like watching another, I don't know what bizarre. Really?

Leo Laporte (00:25:46):
It's TikTok. Yeah. It Googles TikTok. Yeah. So

Stacey Higginbotham (00:25:49):
It's like 2 billion people are using something and I don't even know what it is.

Leo Laporte (00:25:52):
Yeah. Isn't that interesting? Yeah. last year the number was one and a half billion. So it's going up. I asked my son, remember Henry is was, it created a TikTok channel where it was pretty successful, pretty viral. More than 2 million followers. He says, shorts is my new platform. Pretty much. I said, is it reels? Is Insta, is it, is it TikTok? He says, yeah, I'm still on TikTok, but really shorts is YouTube is where I want to be. And I think that's because from a creator's point of view, that's where the money is. Yeah. People look at Mr. Beast Yeah. And say, wow. You can get rich on YouTube if you're successful. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, TikTok, while you get the engagement, you get the audience, the algorithm supports you, you don't get the money. No. And

Jeff Jarvis (00:26:32):
You can subscribe. You don't even necessarily get the engagement. You just get following on TikTok. Right. Right. And whether or not you're gonna get fed, I, well, hen and I never got Henry. Right.

Leo Laporte (00:26:41):
Right. But I mean subscribe to YouTube. I know YouTubers say hit the subscribe button and all that, but that doesn't make you show up more, does it?

Ant Pruitt (00:26:51):
No. We were just talking about this yesterday in the photography and creative arts channel in our club. Twi Discord, by the way my, my subscriber count, I think I have over 4,000 subscribers on YouTube. But when I look at my analytics, it may be 1% of my subscribers actually watching my videos. Really? Wow. The rest of the views are from everywhere else. Youtube from search and search terms and things like that. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>

Leo Laporte (00:27:17):
I'm looking at the things I'm subscribed to here, but that's when I click the subscriptions button, they don't show up here in the recommendations.

Ant Pruitt (00:27:27):
Yeah. Recommendations are always totally different for me.

Leo Laporte (00:27:30):
Although, frankly, these are the ones I'd rather Yeah. I'd rather watch.

Ant Pruitt (00:27:32):
Yeah. And that's, and that was another argument. I think the recommendations does really well for me. Yeah. Our members disagree. Well, some of our members disagreed. But for me, I, I will turn on YouTube, on the television watch and sit on my couch and watch as if I'm watching a

Leo Laporte (00:27:47):
Regular, not, and not your subscriptions, but the recommendations.

Ant Pruitt (00:27:49):
Yeah. The recommendations.

Leo Laporte (00:27:50):
Yeah. And that's, and by the way, that's the lesson learned by TikTok. The lesson learned by Twitter. Now, the For You button and even Threads has now introduced that, you know, they were, for you, they were algorithmically driven for the first few

Ant Pruitt (00:28:05):
Weeks. I wasn't a fan of that. I'm glad they got the power.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:28:07):
Well, this is, I mean, this is what net remember how when you remember when Netflix sent you DVDs in the mail, and they had like,

Ant Pruitt (00:28:14):
I don't know, I'm not that old. Everyone had

Stacey Higginbotham (00:28:15):
Their, their aspirational DVDs and Netflix knew, and they would be like, yeah, okay. These are gonna sit on your, you're, you know, you're gonna have 'em for like four, four weeks before you give up and send 'em back. We subscribe to things like, that's our aspirational sell. And then we click on things that we're like, oh, yeah, that's what I wanna

Ant Pruitt (00:28:38):
See. Yeah. I do need to clean up my YouTube subscriptions. But it, it, I I, I just enjoy what YouTube has figured out about me. But, and it's partly I'm sure because of me hitting like and dislike on things too, right?

Leo Laporte (00:28:52):
Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. <laugh>, I mean,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:28:56):
Yeah. I'm like, they, they can tell how long you watch something and where you stop.

Leo Laporte (00:29:00):
That's more like it. I,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:29:01):
I think that's probably, yeah. They're following. I mean, you know how they're like your action show who you are. Not your words. Uhhuh, <affirmative>, Uhhuh, <affirmative>, the tech companies, they have all the ability to see our actions and they can say, yeah, here's the chance to tell me what you like.

Ant Pruitt (00:29:14):
Yeah. This is where he scrolled past and this is where he paused his scrolling, that kind

Leo Laporte (00:29:19):
Of thing. Yeah. Polls, when they ask what TV channels people watch, they will always say public broadcast <laugh>.

Ant Pruitt (00:29:24):
Yes.

Leo Laporte (00:29:25):
Well, when it actual comes down to ratings, it ain't public broadcasting. Right? No. People are not good self reporters

Stacey Higginbotham (00:29:32):
Unless you're my husband. I swear every time I get in the car, N P R I'm like, he's listening to N P R.

Leo Laporte (00:29:37):
Well, that's 'cause he's a traditional panco liberal left wing

Ant Pruitt (00:29:40):
Now with a lot of the, it's not <laugh> people using, using their mobile phones to consume this stuff. I, I wonder if the whole YouTube shorts number going up is because it was sort of force fed. When you open up YouTube on the mobile app, that's pretty much the first thing I see. Scroll

Jeff Jarvis (00:29:57):
Fast. Facebook too. Really. I, I, I end up watching the damn things. Yeah. And I don't mean to, I don't want to. It's another Irish setter, so I love seeing it. Oh,

Ant Pruitt (00:30:05):
Yep. Gotcha. Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (00:30:06):
But it'll get me once in a while and I'll

Ant Pruitt (00:30:09):
Say, yeah. So I'm wondering if that's part of it too. The same way Threads just sort of force feeds and some different things to us.

Leo Laporte (00:30:17):
I wish they'd given us better. And they don't, companies don't do this anymore. Breakdowns of where the money came from, for instance. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, how much did money did they make on Sunday ticket compared to how much they spent on the N F L? Right. Yep. They started subscriptions in April Zero. Yeah. <laugh>. It's a, it was really,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:30:35):
Yeah. They still have those breakdowns. They just don't tell

Leo Laporte (00:30:38):
Us they know. Oh gosh. Yes. Oh yeah. They know. That's what Ruth

Stacey Higginbotham (00:30:41):
Is looking at.

Leo Laporte (00:30:42):
Yeah. Right. But generally accepted accounting practice is not necessarily what Principles Yeah. Principles is not what we're gonna hear. Google did say that it is reaching 150 million people on connected TV screens in the us

Jeff Jarvis (00:30:59):
So a growth opportunity

Leo Laporte (00:31:01):
That means people are, that's, we're doing watching it on tv it mean,

Ant Pruitt (00:31:06):
But every TV is a connected tv. We're

Stacey Higginbotham (00:31:09):
74% of connected TVs are connected TVs this year. I

Leo Laporte (00:31:13):
Just, all the TVs basically

Ant Pruitt (00:31:16):
Are connected. That's, I'm like, that's a

Stacey Higginbotham (00:31:18):
74%.

Leo Laporte (00:31:19):
That's, but, but I guess that's compared to watching YouTube on your phone. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> Right. Or your computer. They're watching on their TVs. But that's what you just said. Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (00:31:28):
I watched on my television.

Leo Laporte (00:31:29):
Yeah. On

Ant Pruitt (00:31:30):
Television.

Leo Laporte (00:31:30):
Most That's what young people, I I, I remember coming home and seeing Henry when he was in high school with his buddies sitting, watching YouTube on the tv. Yeah. It's like, you know, you can, there's H B O they <laugh>. No, no. We wanna watch.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:31:42):
They don't watch it on the tv. They watch it on an iPad or their laptop don't.

Leo Laporte (00:31:45):
Well, it depends what's there. Right. And they were listening to music. They were actually using it as a music player as much as anything else. Company did announce that it has okay. They last year said that we have 80 million paid users on YouTube premium in music. They did not give a number this time. I'm thinking

Jeff Jarvis (00:32:04):
Of canceling that. They raised, they just raised the price hugely.

Leo Laporte (00:32:08):
Yeah. So, lemme tell you something 'cause you'll cancel it. And then you'll see how many ads you get on YouTube and you'll immediately don't do it. Don't do it. It is so bad. I don't know how people watch YouTube without having a opinion. It's

Ant Pruitt (00:32:19):
Really bad.

Leo Laporte (00:32:20):
Or ad blocking. Maybe you

Stacey Higginbotham (00:32:21):
Just don't watch YouTube.

Leo Laporte (00:32:23):
<Laugh> what plot?

Jeff Jarvis (00:32:25):
Get

Leo Laporte (00:32:26):
Real

Ant Pruitt (00:32:26):
A minute. I,

Jeff Jarvis (00:32:28):
What's the show called? I don't,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:32:30):
I don't spend that much time on YouTube. I mean, I mean, I watch Hot Ones occasionally, or the random

Ant Pruitt (00:32:35):
Clips. I'm Right. You gotta watch Hot Ones or,

Leo Laporte (00:32:37):
Or, or somebody. Somebody hasn't found You just haven't found the thing. But there's Hot ones is my thing. Well, you watch it then. How often do you watch? It's

Ant Pruitt (00:32:47):
Me. I wanna get on here and watch Han Zimmer's in their concerts.

Leo Laporte (00:32:52):
Honestly, I, I watch stuff on YouTube and I feel guilty that I don't watch more stuff. It's like, there's so much good stuff here. I should be looking at YouTube now. All

Ant Pruitt (00:33:00):
Of this is stuff

Leo Laporte (00:33:01):
I feel like I'm violating Anne's privacy.

Ant Pruitt (00:33:03):
No. All of this is stuff that I would watch. Easy, easy

Leo Laporte (00:33:05):
Way to lose weight.

Ant Pruitt (00:33:06):
Easy weight. That's, that's, that's, that's Huberman.

Leo Laporte (00:33:08):
Oh yeah. I, I like it.

Ant Pruitt (00:33:10):
Huber Man's podcast. Tom sra. There's Georgia Dow, M K b h D up here. Yeah. airline pilot guy. It's, they know me. Lewis Ribs for my wife. <Laugh> Lewis Blacks. Red

Leo Laporte (00:33:21):
Past ribs for my wife. Ribs

Ant Pruitt (00:33:24):
For my wife.

Leo Laporte (00:33:25):
Wow. You give it a back After Adam took it.

Ant Pruitt (00:33:27):
Youtube knows me. I

Leo Laporte (00:33:28):
Know That's <laugh> full circle. <Laugh> preparing for the shutdown. What's that?

Ant Pruitt (00:33:35):
That I don't know. Woohoo. Oh, no, no. Oh no, that's the Mercedes-Benz F one team. Oh yeah. I I've watched it. Oh, okay. I watched a lot of this

Leo Laporte (00:33:44):
Stuff too. Yeah. That is a, I like, I like F one on the on the YouTube. I watch a lot of that too. All right. It's like Reddit. Reddit does the same thing. You, you, you tell it what you want and you're gonna get a lot of content you like and it makes it very sticky. So Scooter Re has the number. It's going from 9 99 a month to 1399 a month. That is a big Oh, that is a big

Ant Pruitt (00:34:02):
Increase. I'm on the family plan, so I'm over 20. Wow. For mine. But the thing is, Mr. Jarvis, my card expired couple years ago and I, I didn't think anything about it. And it was almost like we all at the same time decided to watch YouTube in the house. And everybody yelled, what is

Leo Laporte (00:34:20):
Wrong with these ads? It's so bad. It's really bad. There's a lot of pre-roll. They interrupt in the middle show in the middle something. Yes.

Ant Pruitt (00:34:29):
The worst is when they interrupt music. Oh,

Leo Laporte (00:34:31):
Wait a minute. You'll get an ad in a song that's just wrong. Happened to me in the middle of a song. That is terrible. Okay. Okay. Leo, I've got the new business model here. We should just stop right now and play that right in the middle of a sentence. Lisa, Lisa, stick an ad in.

Ant Pruitt (00:34:44):
No,

Leo Laporte (00:34:45):
No, no, no, no. Please. I beg <laugh>. That was, we've had that specific conversation. Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (00:34:52):
Yeah. You don't, you don't want to get those emails.

Leo Laporte (00:34:54):
If that happens, tell us. 'cause We don't, it's not supposed to. The, the way it works, and it isn't gonna be on this show 'cause we have three ads. But if, say we had two ads, we have three slots for three, that third slot, I would, and you've heard me do it, probably I would say, oh, we'll be coming up. We're gonna take your picks of the week, 2, 3, 4, and then we'll do it. And that's, they're supposed to put a tone in, right? Is that what it is? Benito you like? No, it's a, it's like a marker. <Laugh>.

Ant Pruitt (00:35:19):
It's a marker on the timeline.

Leo Laporte (00:35:23):
Nobody else used that bike. Did just hear ad Did it work? The Leo, the appropriate marker is

Ant Pruitt (00:35:33):
Yes. Oh, that

Leo Laporte (00:35:34):
<Laugh>. What does this like pinedo, does it have a sound?

Jeff Jarvis (00:35:39):
No, it's just like a little like line you put in a timeline. Ah,

Leo Laporte (00:35:43):
Okay. But it must like something, so like color bars might, how do they know? Might something you're gonna compress it down and send 'em an MP four. Right. So what do they get in the MP four that, that tells their machinery? Put an ad here.

Jeff Jarvis (00:35:57):
I think it just lines up with a time code. It just says like, okay. Oh,

Leo Laporte (00:35:59):
It's a time code. Yeah,

Jeff Jarvis (00:36:00):
It's a time code.

Leo Laporte (00:36:01):
Okay, well let's get it right 'cause we don't wanna interrupt me in the middle <laugh> of a sentence. Oops. street view is back after a hiatus of 10 years, we used to call Germany B Blury because for some reason they were very privacy focused. They all always would blur their houses. So I

Jeff Jarvis (00:36:22):
Put in a, a video after the story for some reason. Some reason, <laugh> da Schutz, Schutz,

Leo Laporte (00:36:29):
Man, what's that? Germany Schutz

Jeff Jarvis (00:36:31):
Data protection. They don't really have a word for privacy. The word for privacy is data protection. Ah. Which is kinda interesting. Good on them. <Laugh>. So

Leo Laporte (00:36:41):
So this is one of the countries to shun the service. Early on was Germany, where privacy outcry that chu and lawsuits led to <laugh> led to German halting. The Google halting, the street view rollout in 2011, after only covering about 20 big cities. Oh, I didn't know that. They just

Jeff Jarvis (00:36:59):
Stopped. They just stopped. So, so the, the on line 37 don't, it's a long video, but it's a good video. This guy goes back on the story of how this all happened. At the beginning, it was one politician in one small village who decided, I'm going to object to my house being this and I'm gonna go out. And, and he used it for political ends. And that's what spreads. It was one little village in Germany that then spread

Leo Laporte (00:37:21):
Around crazy, drove crazy. They formed a human chain to keep the Google Street view car from driving down their streets because they were afraid of crime. You will see our house, you will see how beautiful it is. You will burglarize it. Is that, was that the theory that

Jeff Jarvis (00:37:36):
The theory was the politicians saw a good

Leo Laporte (00:37:38):
Is politics. Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (00:37:40):
And so and so now, but, but

Leo Laporte (00:37:41):
Stacey, you believe that because you just said what? I said, why would you do it? You said, what do you mean? Why would you do it?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:37:47):
Do you Well, there, I mean, if you're concerned about like, people finding out where you live, it's like if you,

Leo Laporte (00:37:55):
I, it's not like you have a sign in the window that says, I live here. <Laugh>.

Jeff Jarvis (00:38:00):
I mean,

Leo Laporte (00:38:00):
Yeah. You could drive by my house and see it anyway. I think you,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:38:05):
I think you can look up my address. Let's see if I can look up my address.

Leo Laporte (00:38:09):
Oh, yeah, yeah. No, that you don't even have to do that. I mean, of course you can because all of that stuff's public record. Unless you take extraordinary, ordinary steps.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:38:16):
But, and then you can put it there and then you can see my actual house. Yeah. I mean, I know that you can, I mean, and what if I have like, then maybe my car's parked out there and you get my driver's license or actually my

Leo Laporte (00:38:27):
License. License. You could drive, you could drive over and do that. But that's the point is anybody anywhere in the world could do it without coming over. It just

Stacey Higginbotham (00:38:33):
Reduces the friction. Yeah. Is kind of like to find out a little bit more about someone. See, or maybe, maybe, I don't want you to know that I live in a massive mansion. <Laugh>, do

Leo Laporte (00:38:42):
You blur your mansion?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:38:44):
I I don't live in a massive mansion.

Leo Laporte (00:38:46):
But that, but you blur it.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:38:48):
No, no, no. I don't, I

Leo Laporte (00:38:50):
Don't know. You can go. I'm not sure that you can do that in other countries. They, they, you can't. Yeah, you can blur. Can you? Oh yeah. Really?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:38:56):
You can ask them. Also the street view car. My, my, my house is now set back enough from the road that it's less problematic. But I hated the fact that like, my rooftop deck and my old house was visible on like the aerial satellite views. You could see like the little platforms. I could

Leo Laporte (00:39:12):
See what you were working on. <Laugh>.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:39:14):
You couldn't see me. I wasn't out when they did that particular shot. Might have been, it's kind of intrusive.

Leo Laporte (00:39:18):
Could have been. Yeah. Yeah. You can go to Google Maps. This is according to Mashable. Go to Google Maps and search for your address and then enter street view by, you know, tapping on that weird yellow man. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And then when your house is in view, click report a problem. Oh, that's ridiculous. Ah. And then send to the red box in your home and select my home in the request blurring field. So you could say, please blur this. You see here, this area was blurred

Ant Pruitt (00:39:50):
Better. Yeah. You can just try to keep your

Leo Laporte (00:39:53):
Address. Oh, and what would you like us to blur? A face? My home, my license plate. Oh, different. They do

Ant Pruitt (00:39:59):
Blur license

Leo Laporte (00:40:00):
Plates. Yeah. Yeah. If they, yeah, they do. If it's not blurred, it's they missed it somehow. Yeah. Right. Yeah. So that's

Ant Pruitt (00:40:04):
Why it's a problem. Yeah. Everything I've ever looked ats been blurred. Even the picture of my uncle in my grandma's front

Leo Laporte (00:40:10):
Yard faces get blurred. Yeah. He was blurred out. Did his behind get blurred when he, when he

Ant Pruitt (00:40:14):
His behind

Leo Laporte (00:40:15):
Didn't get blurred when he <laugh>. If you saw the Google Street view car, would you immediately drop trout?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:40:25):
No.

Ant Pruitt (00:40:25):
I have no comment. I

Leo Laporte (00:40:26):
Know people who would give it the finger. Yeah. What are that? It's kind of fun to go, go around in, in all of this and, and see how people respond. 'cause You do see people Yeah. In street view making gesture, making rude gestures and various things. All right, let me, let me go here. No, this is giving me rooting. I don't know what this is telling me. How many times I've gone to work. <Laugh>, I don't. Too many. There's a loop. Too few. I think many would say. I don't know what's going this. Somehow I got my timeline. I don't want that. There you go.

Ant Pruitt (00:41:01):
You just trying to find a location. Just

Leo Laporte (00:41:03):
Click on, yeah, I wanna, and then I want the yellow, little yellow man. Okay. There's the jack in the box. So you turn it left to the jack in the box, and you go down the street. Here it is. Here's twit. Okay. There's twit. Now where's the yellow man? It's on the bottom, right? There we go. Here's the yellow man.

Ant Pruitt (00:41:22):
And then click on the blue streets. Nope. Click on that.

Leo Laporte (00:41:25):
Oh, and then this has how you go there. Okay. Now, oh good. Here we go. Here we go. Now I could then say, report a problem.

Jeff Jarvis (00:41:33):
Where's the twit sign?

Leo Laporte (00:41:35):
There it is. You can see it. If I go down here, where do you

Jeff Jarvis (00:41:37):
Wanna go down this. What, what's in front of it? It's,

Leo Laporte (00:41:38):
Boy, they did this. It was, it, it had just range. There you go. There we go. That's what I should blur, right. Which car were you

Jeff Jarvis (00:41:43):
Driving then?

Leo Laporte (00:41:43):
Oh yeah. Look at all the, all the drivers autos are blurred, right? Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (00:41:47):
Looks like the tag. Yeah. They, they auto blur it.

Leo Laporte (00:41:50):
None, none of these are my car. You weren't working that day. I wasn't <laugh>

Jeff Jarvis (00:41:55):
<Laugh>.

Leo Laporte (00:41:56):
I wasn't. We caught you Leo caught me this day off.

Ant Pruitt (00:41:59):
That shot was taken at nine in the morning. He's not

Leo Laporte (00:42:01):
<Laugh>. Maybe because it's a business. I can't report a problem. Maybe that's why.

Jeff Jarvis (00:42:07):
But you don't own the building. You

Ant Pruitt (00:42:08):
Should still be able to report a problem if it's a business here. Do you want my old address?

Leo Laporte (00:42:13):
No, no, no. It's okay. But anyway, so report. You don't wanna do that to your report. A I don't wanna blur actually. Yeah, no, you're right. Anyway, somewhere around here, there'll be a report, a problem.

Jeff Jarvis (00:42:23):
But, but the funny thing about the Germany is, so this has been out, I guess, for two weeks that they're returning to Germany and nobody has, there's not been a peep, not a single

Leo Laporte (00:42:32):
Peep. Because you gotta get that one politician. Well,

Jeff Jarvis (00:42:34):
This, this, the guy in the video returned to the town and tried to find the politician. He's dead. Because it's been, what, 10 years since they left.

Leo Laporte (00:42:44):
That's interesting. If you had blurred it 10 years ago, maybe would you, you would, I don't know. View is this are they celebrated? Is this happy news? It looks like Yeah. Yeah. With exclamation mark and everything. Yeah. Yeah. There's the little yellow man floating over in a balloon. Let's take a little

Ant Pruitt (00:43:07):
Break. Yeah. I think, I think people wanted to actually see the restaurant they were going to, you know, stuff like that. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (00:43:11):
I think street view's very useful. I love

Ant Pruitt (00:43:13):
It. Yeah. I do too. I, I use it a lot. Especially when trying to figure out how to

Leo Laporte (00:43:17):
Park. Maybe what we need to do is get some burglars on the line. And, and ask them. We don't have burglars if it's in our audience. If you are a no, I,

Ant Pruitt (00:43:26):
I wonder about that. Keith. 12. 12. And that dwindle and that, especially that scooter. It's name. It,

Leo Laporte (00:43:32):
It's definitely, definitely a burglary, actually. You know, where you go to find all the twit community? You don't even, and we don't blurt or anything. It's discourse. We are, yes. Big fans of our twit community on discourse. We've been using discourse for three or four years now. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And I'm very pleased they've become a sponsor. Woo. Which is great. It's the online home for our community. It could be the online home for your community too. For more than a decade. Discourse has made it their mission to make the internet a better place for online communities. I learned about discourse from an expert in online communities. John l Bacon, who said, you don't have a discourse. I said, no. He said, you gotta do it. This was in a triangulation episode a few years ago. So I did, couldn't have been easier to set it up.

(00:44:13):
It's been great ever since by harnessing the power of discussion. Real time chat. And yes, AI discourse makes it easy to have meaningful conversations and collaborate with your community anytime, anywhere. I would love for you to join our discourse at TWIT community. Take a, at what we've done there. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And then if it's time for your business or your club, or your group or your family to create a community, visit discourse.org/twit and you'll get one month free on all self-serve plans. Discourse is used. It's funny, once I started using discourse, I started seeing it everywhere. All the biggest companies in the world use discourse. We love it. 'cause It's open source. More than 20,000 online communities. And I've, I've used forum software in the past that's been hard to use, or buggy or unreliable. Discourse has never been anything but sweet. Very smooth, very fast, very easy to manage, administer.

(00:45:13):
And, and I think for our users, very easy to participate in. Whether you're just starting out or want to take your community to the next level, there's a plan for you for there's a basic plan for private invite only communities that'd be great for your family. For instance, a standard plan. If you want unlimited members in a public presence, we use the business plan, of course, for active customer support communities. Jonathan Bilbo, who's developer advocate at Twitch, said discourse, and this is a quote, direct quote, is the most amazing thing we've ever used. We've never experienced software so reliable, ever. It is, it is super reliable. Discourse hosts our twit community. They do a great job. One of the biggest advantages to creating your own community with discourse is you own your own data. Oh, there's Jonah Bacon community. There he is, right there.

(00:46:02):
You will always have access to all of your conversation. History discourse never will sell your data to advertisers. There's no advertising on our discourse. You know, discourse is for your community and it gives you everything you need in one place. And as the guy, this I, you know, I administer this Paul Holder helps me out. He kind of volunteered. But it's, it's a, it's easy for us, just the two of us to manage the whole place because these tools are so good. Make discourse the online home for your community. Visit discourse.org/twit. Get one month free and all self-serve plans, discourse.org/twit. And if you wanna see what it, what it's like to be in a discourse community, you spend a lot of time in there. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> discourse, our discourse is a twit community. And we, we love it.

Ant Pruitt (00:46:51):
A lot of fun conversations in there. Yeah. Like I said,

Leo Laporte (00:46:53):
And very affordable.

Ant Pruitt (00:46:55):
They go in there and, and, and they, they'll talk about, basically have some reactions to the show.

Leo Laporte (00:47:00):
And that's our place for Yeah. In a way, you know, I didn't wanna, we turned off YouTube comments 'cause it's too hard to moderate, moderate it and all that. Right. So this is all here. Every time a show is posted, I have a Zapier script that posts creates a new mm-hmm. <Affirmative> thread on Discord for it automatically. So every episode of every show, including this one, is is here. And then people go in there and, and make their comments. Here's a guy who didn't like the show and ant you responded, which is great. <Laugh>. So what's your problems, <laugh>? No, I mean, but that's, that's kind of the fun part about it. And then people post other stuff as well. Yeah. Yeah. I really I really enjoy it. Every now and then, we get some dissertations in there too. It's okay. <Laugh>. That's okay.

(00:47:43):
It is good. It is. Okay. It's been quite informative. Somebody different perspectives. Somebody somebody <laugh>, it's a picture of me, <laugh>. We were talking about you know, Steve mentioned that he, he could hear in the background of security now a beep every once in a while. <Laugh>, we all thought it was his smoke detector. So we ended up talking about smoke detectors. And then I said, well, I can't figure out, I have these smoke detectors I took off and I don't know where to put them. And we had a big long discussion, <laugh>, about the resum radioactive material and the smoke detectors. And apparently it's completely legal to to throw it in the landfill. Even though <laugh>, oh boy, it's a halflife of Erum is pretty long. It decays into Neptune 2 37 with a halflife of 2.14 million years <laugh>. And I said, well, dissertation. We, we, we, we, we initially we thought about eating it, eating them, but we decided instead I had 'em in the backseat. My, my friends got in the car and said, why do you have, why do you have smoke sex in your backseat? I said, because I don't know where to put 'em in the back of the, I don't wanna leave 'em in the house. So they're in my car driving around with 'em.

Jeff Jarvis (00:48:56):
Unbelievable. So you radiate yourself.

Leo Laporte (00:48:58):
Yeah. Better me. Anyway. Unbelievable. These are the kinds of conversations we have at Twitter community moving along. Let's see. Hmm. There's not a lot of stories today. It's kind of a,

Jeff Jarvis (00:49:13):
Do you wanna hear about my visit to Google?

Leo Laporte (00:49:14):
How? Oh, yes. So I, you, you're very efficient. 'cause You, you, you spoke last night at the Commonwealth Club. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And you, when did you go to Google? Today?

Jeff Jarvis (00:49:24):
Yesterday

Leo Laporte (00:49:24):
Morning. Yesterday. Okay. Yeah. So you flew in on Monday? Yeah, flew

Jeff Jarvis (00:49:27):
On Monday. Okay. hit, hit my used bookstores which I like to do. Bought a, bought a book about Linotype and, and unions. Because

Leo Laporte (00:49:35):
You, you lived in San Francisco for years. 'cause I know I used to read you and the, was it the Examiner? Examiner? Yeah. So homecoming, it's like, yeah. Going back to the old, old town, it's,

Jeff Jarvis (00:49:46):
Yeah. So I went, I went down to Google. Steven Johnson is there now at notebook Lmm,

Leo Laporte (00:49:50):
And, oh, I wanna hear what this is.

Jeff Jarvis (00:49:52):
That's what I'm tell you about. So but Steve Steven's a wonderful guy. He is written 15 books there. He's a, he's nicest guy on earth and very, very smart and very generous. And I was surprised to hear that he was working at Google and he wrote a medium post about this a few weeks ago. And he's the editorial director of Notebook Lmm, which I love that they now have that titled inside Google,

Leo Laporte (00:50:14):
Because notebook LMSs sounds like an AI notebook.

Jeff Jarvis (00:50:18):
It it is in essence. So I got a demonstration of it. And I got into it as well. I thought I might be able to demonstrate it on the show, but I double checked. And there's no greater force in Silicon Valley than comms. So you wanna be careful about comms,

Leo Laporte (00:50:31):
Never ask them. Right. In other

Jeff Jarvis (00:50:32):
Words so, so I won't demo it.

Leo Laporte (00:50:34):
This is, it's in their project Tailwind. But you have, you have to sign up for it or,

Jeff Jarvis (00:50:37):
Yeah, and I got, I got let in. Okay. but what they demoed as well, so for example, yesterday they put in this,

Leo Laporte (00:50:43):
They showed this at Google io. This was actually when they showed it. You said this was one of the things that you were most interested in, that they showed.

Jeff Jarvis (00:50:50):
Yeah. And then, and then suddenly I see that it's Steven Johnson who's working on it. Nice. 'cause Steven has worked, he told me, he talked for years and years about the tool that he wanted. He's terribly organized, unlike me. So every single quote of a book he reads in, in Amazon, he has saved, he has thousands of quotes that he has saved attributed to the source so he can use 'em in books. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Well now he can, he can for example, pull that into notebook, lmm and then query it, ask it questions, who said this? Who all talked about this? And so on and so forth. Yesterday they put in when I was there the earnings report for Google. And they

Leo Laporte (00:51:28):
Oh, wow.

Jeff Jarvis (00:51:29):
Yeah. So it comes back and it gives you the summary of revenues. This,

Leo Laporte (00:51:33):
This would be great for me. Yeah. With these news stories. Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (00:51:37):
Oh, it's, it's amazing. Yeah. It gives you key topics for it. And then you can try questions. So gimme a question. I'm, I'm not really demonstrating here. I'm just kind of not demonstrate it. Gimme a question to ask of the Google report.

Leo Laporte (00:51:52):
Why don't you, Stacy, it was the breakout of revenue for Oh. Of YouTube premium versus

Jeff Jarvis (00:51:58):
Ad revenue. Well, we don't, they didn't do that, so, oh. It's gonna tell you. Oh,

Leo Laporte (00:52:01):
Duh. F off. Yeah. Well, maybe it'll make up something useful. No, <laugh>. Well,

Jeff Jarvis (00:52:06):
How much has

Leo Laporte (00:52:07):
Google Cloud revenue increased in the last five years? Perfect. I want a graph and graph it. I'm, I'm joining the wait list. You can go to notebook lmm.google.com and sign up for a wait list. I'm

Jeff Jarvis (00:52:22):
Sorry, but I couldn't find enough context in the document, so it said it couldn't apply. I

Leo Laporte (00:52:25):
Love that though. That's what it should say. This is not something up. You

Jeff Jarvis (00:52:28):
Give it a document. It does just that document. Yeah. That's what gives me the best, most hope about this, is that it's not going off and finding stuff. You can't figure out where it is saying, you gave me this document with that document in hand. I will, I will give you a glossary. I will tell you, I, I did one document and I said, who, who does a quote? Give a list of who quotes glossary is what they demonstrated at io. But, but the fact that I can query my own documents, I think is, is amazing. But this is augmented. It's not trying to replace the writer. It's trying to help the writer organize their work. And you know, they asked me how I work and I said, well, of slob. So for the, for Gutenberg, I have two huge, two or three huge files of paper that I print out so I can mark it up and put stars by it and put X's where I disagree. Old school and all kinds of stuff. Right. I love

Leo Laporte (00:53:21):
That old

Jeff Jarvis (00:53:22):
School. Well, I would change my way of working though. I would, I would get a remarkable two or something, and I would mark up the PDFs so that I can import the PDFs into, right now it just works with Google Docs, but import them in as Google Docs and then I could start to query my own stuff and find out find out trends or, or that I'm missing find out quotes that I missed, or who the hell said that I know somebody did. It'd be quite amazing. So it's, it's impressive. And I just met with the team and, and they're, they're fairly early on. They hope to, I think everybody will get in by the

Leo Laporte (00:54:00):
Fall. Oh, good. The example they used at io, which I thought was really great, was taking a bunch of lecture notes and class notes Yeah. And documents and putting 'em in one database. And now you have this great tool as a student to ask questions, to, to understand a lecture, to summarize a lecture just really seems like a great tool. Did they

Stacey Higginbotham (00:54:22):
Talk about privacy? 'cause Like, one of the things that I think,

Jeff Jarvis (00:54:26):
Go ahead. What did

Stacey Higginbotham (00:54:27):
They say?

Jeff Jarvis (00:54:28):
No, you go ahead.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:54:28):
Well, so like, question as a journalist, I talk to people under embargo, for example, and I write my notes, you know, and then I, like, I, I, I don't know if I'd feel secure putting my notes in there, or, I mean, I don't, if I, if I'm actually doing something off the record, like a whole meeting is off the record, then my notes like, won't have their name. But sometimes people will take something off the record in like my notes. They're like, oh, let's take this off the record, and they'll tell me something.

Jeff Jarvis (00:54:57):
I, I asked that question, Stacy. Because that case where the Samsung people put stuff in a chat, G P T, that it started showing up all over. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, they said that your data will not teach the model and will not be used anywhere else. Now you're trusting Google that, but it's already in your Google Docs. You already

Stacey Higginbotham (00:55:16):
Yeah. I mean, like, I already drive. Yeah. I already write in Google Docs. I get my email. I mean, I'm accepting embargoes in Gmail.

Jeff Jarvis (00:55:23):
Right, right. Exactly. You know, so, so I think as long as we're, the fact that it's going to eliminate the model becomes smart. The model knows how to do stuff, then the model is put to specific Corpus's Corp. Corpus Py

Leo Laporte (00:55:36):
Corp. Corpus Corp.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:55:38):
How about corpses?

Leo Laporte (00:55:40):
Corpses, corpses

Jeff Jarvis (00:55:41):
Of Data Corp. Where you can ra. Thank you very much. I had to think

Leo Laporte (00:55:45):
Of it.

Leo Laporte (00:55:46):
It's Latin's been a long time. Yeah, that was what that was. Did you go to Yale? I did, yes. <Laugh>, thank you very much for asking. I went to the best school in New Haven,

Jeff Jarvis (00:55:56):
<Laugh>

Stacey Higginbotham (00:55:57):
<Laugh>.

Jeff Jarvis (00:56:00):
But the fact that this can, can, can, you can limit what this looks at and you can verify it, I think is just, is just critical. And it's a lot smarter than the companies that are using LLMs to write news stories because it's the dumbest thing you can do. I'm

Leo Laporte (00:56:12):
Actually want this. Mashed potatoes said this would be great for the change log. I could put all the change log articles in. Yep, yep, yep. And say, write me at five minute, or actually five seconds change log <laugh>. And we just, we could whizz through that. Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (00:56:25):
So I, I think, so I put in a ver there was on

Leo Laporte (00:56:27):
Why do they need an editorial director though? What does that mean? So

Jeff Jarvis (00:56:30):
What it means is that he's the product person as the, as the, he's a local customer, I think. Okay. I think Steven, there is a writer and they've, they, they went and they talked to a bunch of NYU students.

Leo Laporte (00:56:41):
Here's a question. Maybe this is more for Stacey. This is an l l m trained exclusively, right? On the stuff you give? No,

Jeff Jarvis (00:56:50):
They're using, they're using a model that Google

Leo Laporte (00:56:51):
Has. Okay. So it's been trained on other stuff,

Jeff Jarvis (00:56:54):
On the data that you

Leo Laporte (00:56:55):
Have. So I guess, and it's trained on another stuff. So that has grammar and sentence structure. That's the whole magic. All it understands how to speak. Right. Okay.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:57:04):
I mean, I would love this, even if it's not privacy focused. If I could send my entire, like, website through there every story I've written about the I O T. Yes. And then so I can be like, Hey, when did Amazon announce its steel for Roomba? What was the price? And then it will give it to me and I don't have to go look it up. And then

Leo Laporte (00:57:24):
Could probably even make the newsletter easier for you too. This is the stuff that I posted this week. Here are some highlights. So, by the way, according to dictionary, the plural of Corpus's Corp. I That is wrong. I said <inaudible> wrong. This internet thing, it's wrong. Wait a minute. Let me go. I think it's Ra. Let me see which

Stacey Higginbotham (00:57:47):
Source the Yes.

Leo Laporte (00:57:48):
Which source are you going to trust, sir <laugh>. This is

Stacey Higginbotham (00:57:51):
The Apache Software Foundation.

Leo Laporte (00:57:52):
My brain, which is

Stacey Higginbotham (00:57:53):
Not helpful.

Leo Laporte (00:57:54):
Okay. Corpus is a neuter noun, not a masculine. If we're m gonna be corpus noun or bi, it's neuter must to hurt, which is not male or female. <Laugh> neuter nouns are pluralized with corpora. My, my memory was good. It's accurate. Or is the word masculine?

Stacey Higginbotham (00:58:11):
Webster says ura.

Leo Laporte (00:58:13):
Yeah. 'cause Merriam Webster's, right. <Laugh>. I wish they'd asked this on jeopardy. Why don't they ever ask this on jeopardy? That's what I wanted. Would've gotten it wrong because you would've been sent home. I would've been slow and figure that out. Oh,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:58:28):
They do. They really think so. Corp is also the bo the definition is the body of a human or animal. Especially when dead.

Jeff Jarvis (00:58:35):
Yeah. Body's a body.

Leo Laporte (00:58:36):
Yeah. It's a corpse. That's where the word corpse comes from. Well,

Stacey Higginbotham (00:58:39):
I know, but that's what

Leo Laporte (00:58:40):
Or body of, I

Stacey Higginbotham (00:58:41):
Didn't inform know Corpus was a synonym body

Leo Laporte (00:58:43):
Of information Corp.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:58:45):
Right, right. I just thought it was an information, not a physical thing. Mm-Hmm.

Leo Laporte (00:58:49):
Was as often the case with the metaphoric Latin words. They assume and knew more metaphor. This one

Jeff Jarvis (00:58:56):
About a body of water. Is that a corporate word?

Leo Laporte (00:58:58):
I don't know.

Jeff Jarvis (00:58:59):
I dunno. So I put

Stacey Higginbotham (00:59:00):
It depends on if it's surrounded by land or not. No. <laugh>.

Leo Laporte (00:59:06):
Wait a minute. A body of water that's not surrounded by land is what? Water.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:59:11):
An ocean. An

Leo Laporte (00:59:12):
Ocean. No. Oceans are surrounded by, it's still water.

Jeff Jarvis (00:59:15):
We're not surrounded.

Leo Laporte (00:59:16):
Okay. This show is really

Stacey Higginbotham (00:59:17):
No. Lakes are surrounded,

Leo Laporte (00:59:19):
Gotten.

Stacey Higginbotham (00:59:19):
And if it's surrounded on like a few sides,

Leo Laporte (00:59:22):
Bays, thank you for going to Google and talking. So these guys still welcome you as one of their own as a friend? No, no,

Jeff Jarvis (00:59:28):
Just, just a friend. I, I, so I was in the labs area 'cause they got rid of the old labs. And this is a new labs. It's more pro product focused. And, and then I had, yes, folks, I had lunch there, by the way. So I was quoted in the New York Times story about a different project, which project Genesis, which is supposed to help journalists. And somebody put up on Twitter and said, well, Jarvis is paid by Google. That's, I said, no, I'm not. Then he came back and he said, well, you gave a policy talk there in 2011. I thought, oh hell.

Leo Laporte (01:00:00):
Did they pay you for that? I looked

Jeff Jarvis (01:00:01):
Up my email. 'cause I thought, I thought maybe I, I don't think so. I think I've been good about this. I looked at my email they wouldn't pay my expenses. I lost money on it. <Laugh>,

Leo Laporte (01:00:10):
He pays Google to talk to them. Yeah. Yeah. We're gonna take a little break and we come back. We'll have a musical interlude. We're gonna have a little singing. Oh boy. Here in the studio. Right.

Ant Pruitt (01:00:20):
Boy, boy, this is

Leo Laporte (01:00:20):
Scary. I'm excited. I'm excited. The queen is in. The queen is in in the house. Queen

Ant Pruitt (01:00:26):
Crew has shown up. Y'all.

Leo Laporte (01:00:28):
You guys sing for us.

Leo Laporte (01:00:31):
I hear Yes. I hear

Jeff Jarvis (01:00:33):
Your right answer is

Leo Laporte (01:00:34):
Yeah. I hear your working on a new musical. No. No. Mm-Hmm.

Jeff Jarvis (01:00:39):
What's the new musical? She, she,

Ant Pruitt (01:00:40):
She wanted to come here and, and say hello to Mr. Jarvis. 'cause he's in town

Jeff Jarvis (01:00:45):
And I wanted to be able to say hello to you. All

Leo Laporte (01:00:47):
Right. So even better after this commercial, there will be no singing.

Jeff Jarvis (01:00:51):
Good. Oh, I think

Leo Laporte (01:00:53):
<Laugh>. I promise.

Jeff Jarvis (01:00:55):
What's the new musical?

Speaker 6 (01:00:57):
I'm trying not to do

Leo Laporte (01:00:59):
Another musical. They want her drives crazy. They keep pulling her in. Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (01:01:04):
Musicals is all just out there.

Speaker 6 (01:01:05):
Yeah. But I'm learning. I have to find my voice.

Leo Laporte (01:01:09):
Well, let's hear a little, what would your voice sound like if you found it? <Laugh>

Ant Pruitt (01:01:13):
Put you on the spot.

Speaker 6 (01:01:14):
I mean, can I get a breath? Like, I just came in

Leo Laporte (01:01:17):
<Laugh>. Okay. Take a breath. That's why I was gonna do the

Speaker 6 (01:01:20):
Get a chance to warm up.

Leo Laporte (01:01:22):
I want a high C Okay. When we come back. Okay. Can you sing something from the SpongeBob musical? Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (01:01:29):
Spongebob Your greatest

Leo Laporte (01:01:30):
Hits. One of your greatest hits. All right. You, you have some time. Get some, get your wind back. And although that sounded pretty good, <laugh>, this is what you hear, right? Yeah. I was like,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:01:40):
That sounded better than anything

Leo Laporte (01:01:41):
I could do. Yeah. Well,

Jeff Jarvis (01:01:42):
Well, that's stemming with Faith Praise Stacey

Leo Laporte (01:01:45):
<Laugh>.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:01:47):
Okay. That is true. How

Leo Laporte (01:01:48):
Did you know I

Jeff Jarvis (01:01:49):
Was, you're you're honest about that, Stacy,

Leo Laporte (01:01:51):
Our show today brought to you by a w s Insiders, a fast-paced, entertaining, insightful look behind the scenes of Amazon Web Services and cloud computing. But we're not talking your typical Talking Heads Tech podcast. It's high production value, high energy, high entertainment, full of captivating stories from the early days of a w s today and beyond. And really a lot of it comes down to the host, Rahul Supermanium, who's a great, great host, Hillary Doyle, who joins him. They dig into the current state and future of a w s by talking with the people and companies that know it best. Rahul is a veteran, a w s Pro 15 years experience managing more than 45,000 a w s instances. He's known for pushing a W Ss products to their limits for believing a w s is truly the operating system of the future. And he's funny too.

(01:02:47):
He's a lot of fun. A w s Insiders is a show that's full of opinions, takeaways, and untold stories about the challenges, innovations, and the mind blowing promise of cloud computing. The season two, episode three, you must absolutely listen to. They do talk a lot about ai. The se episode six is a future of ai with regard to a w s, but I loved the story of Moderna and Mr. N and a w s Rahul. Hillary and Moderna's, director of Data Engineering and Cloud architecture talked about how Moderna depends on the cloud to do their work. Fascinating. Episode five. The Price Is Wrong. How to Save on a w s So you need some really valuable stuff. And the guest on how to Save a Steven Barn. He's really knowledgeable about getting the best deal. Check it all out. A WS insiders, look for it in your podcast player. Or visit cloud fix.oria.com/podcast cloud fix dot a uea.com/podcast. We also include a link in the show notes or just search for it in your favorite podcast player. And thanks to a w Ss insiders for their support, A w s Insiders. Really great show. More update from Google. One more update from Google. Says Jeff Jar. Google. Yes.

Jeff Jarvis (01:04:14):
No dessert.

Leo Laporte (01:04:15):
What?

Jeff Jarvis (01:04:15):
Really? No

Leo Laporte (01:04:16):
Dessert. You bought lunch with wine.

Jeff Jarvis (01:04:17):
Yeah. Dessert. Yeah, I had a package sandwich, which is fine. It was free. And you can't, you can't buy me with a sandwich. And there was a huge line out the building for whatever they were serving in the main thing. And there was no dessert. I wanted a cookie.

Leo Laporte (01:04:29):
They're being healthy there. No cookies. Come on. In the old days they would have M and MSM and jars and there were swish fish. Yeah. Now, now. And I think it's good they've gotten rid of all that. I,

Jeff Jarvis (01:04:39):
I got a little, I got some dried pineapple.

Leo Laporte (01:04:42):
Much better for you.

Jeff Jarvis (01:04:43):
Yeah, I know, but geez,

Leo Laporte (01:04:45):
Bologna makes you taste better too. No bologna either. <Laugh>. No, no. Bologna. I don't. Good things are good for

Jeff Jarvis (01:04:50):
I would go

Leo Laporte (01:04:50):
For dried mango. That stuff stuff. Yeah. Dry print's good. Yeah. Yeah. So we were talking about numbers. Spreadsheet leaked out. Uhoh from Google. Business Insider. Got it. Data voluntary submitted by over 12,000 Google employees for the year 2022. Software engineers, business analysts, salespeople, insider ran it through notebook, LMM. No, they did not. <Laugh>. That would be insulting. They did analyze it. And they have a table of searchable roles with data on salary. The minimum and maximum base salaries, equity and bonuses. And sometimes those bonuses are hefty. The highest paid software engineer engineering the data. A level seven employee software engineer base salary, $718,000 a year. Most software engineers did not get that much. In fact, they ranged from a hundred thousand to $375,000 a year. Those are very hot in demand.

Ant Pruitt (01:05:54):
They gotta be really, really good.

Jeff Jarvis (01:05:56):
Well, how many levels are there in the

Leo Laporte (01:05:58):
Well I'm guessing that if, if, if he's making $718,000 a year at level seven, I think there is no level eight. Yeah. I think that's gotta be. But

Ant Pruitt (01:06:08):
Even, do you think even someone at that pay scale are they treated more like mercenaries? They're, they're just there for the job. I

Leo Laporte (01:06:16):
Betcha. Would it be a, a year, two years? That's by the way, just based salary, not including stock. Right. Okay. Right,

Ant Pruitt (01:06:23):
Because see, I didn't, I didn't know any, I'm not gonna sit here and say I know any level seven devs, but the ones that I know that are really good, they're pretty much mercenaries. They, they don't stick around very long.

Jeff Jarvis (01:06:31):
Sorry. Yeah. So there's a software engineer, level two, I guess you don't want any ones at Google. 3, 4, 5, 6, 7. Then the principal engineer is level eight Director. Oh. Distinguished engineer is level nine. Senior director. And, pardon me, there was an ad blocker in here and a Google fellow, or is a level 10 or vice president.

Leo Laporte (01:06:53):
None of those people were in the spreadsheet

Jeff Jarvis (01:06:55):
At Google. Senior software engineer, engineer is level 11.

Leo Laporte (01:06:59):
Oh. So it does go a

Ant Pruitt (01:07:00):
Lot higher. Dang. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:07:01):
Wow.

Jeff Jarvis (01:07:02):
This guy has a future or gal.

Leo Laporte (01:07:05):
Cloud sales. 302,000 research scientist. 309,000 UX designed 315,000. The highest equity at Google. This is the stock participation. Wow. I I think this must be per year software engineer. $1.5 million. Hmm. Wow. That, that's why stock is so important, right? Yeah. And there was an engineer who got a $605,000 bonus. Do you think people told the truth in this <laugh>,

Ant Pruitt (01:07:36):
I

Leo Laporte (01:07:37):
Got $1 million. I think they must have. Right? This is a, anyway, interesting. If you're interested at a job at Google, it's a what you'd expect. It pays well. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Even if you don't get dessert, <laugh>, no desserts

Ant Pruitt (01:07:53):
For you. Whatever happened to Erica Joy Baker? Since we're talking about spreadsheets and salaries, y'all remember her from Google. I

Leo Laporte (01:08:01):
Remember Erica Joy, she's Baker, but was her married

Ant Pruitt (01:08:03):
Name. She, she's Baker. I know, I remember she got married a a couple years ago. I, I don't know what else has happened with her. 'cause She went from Google, then she ended up at Slack at some point.

Leo Laporte (01:08:13):
She's now an engineer for San Francisco Bay Area. Chief Technology Officer for the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee. Oh, she was great. Yeah. I I used to follow her on Twitter. Absolutely. Yeah. She's still around. Good for her. <Laugh> still around, but now working in politics, it sounds like you're working for the city. Good. Ah, what is the web integrity? A p i?

Jeff Jarvis (01:08:41):
It's pissing people off.

Leo Laporte (01:08:43):
Steve Gibson yesterday talked about it as Google's proposal to end ad blockers. Like, oh, you can trust us. <Laugh>, you don't need no. And block here. Nevermind. Our year over year quarterly earnings. We're Ron Amadio writing at ours. Technica, Google's nightmare web integrity. A p I wants a D r M gatekeeper for the web. It's just a proposal, but it's already being prototyped inside Chrome. I

Jeff Jarvis (01:09:13):
Didn't really understand. I put another story up too. I didn't understand what it is. Yeah. How it works. Can you explain it?

Leo Laporte (01:09:19):
I can't, I wish I'd listened to Steve, but I was <laugh>

Jeff Jarvis (01:09:23):
Off getting your coffee. Coffee. You

Leo Laporte (01:09:23):
Host the show. Playing a game. I okay, here's here's the Google's. Explain. This

Jeff Jarvis (01:09:30):
Is why we need to put Steve's transcript into notebook lm and ask it. Right.

Leo Laporte (01:09:35):
Lemme just check and see what they, users often depend on websites trusting the client environment they run in your browser is running on your computer. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, they, they, you know, you trust it. Right. This trust may assume the client environment is honest <laugh> about why wouldn't it be, be about certain aspects of itself keeps user data in intellectual property secure and is transparent about whether or not a human is using it.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:10:05):
So like, not a web scraper.

Leo Laporte (01:10:07):
The

Stacey Higginbotham (01:10:09):
Or

Leo Laporte (01:10:11):
That makes no sense. I mean, trust, backbone,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:10:13):
Cap. I mean, this is kind of like what captions are in terms of like, are you a human filling out the form? Are you a human surfing this site? Are you,

Jeff Jarvis (01:10:23):
It got described as a, as a, as a form of D R M.

Leo Laporte (01:10:26):
Yeah. I don't know if that's accurate either. So here's some examples of the scenarios where users depend on client trust. And I think when they say this, what they're saying is, when you go to a website, you trust that the website itself is reliable. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Okay. You wouldn't go to otherwise. Yeah. Well, but except you do all the time. Right. Even though, you know, the, the website might be spying on you in, in effect with third party cookies and things. Users like visiting websites that are expensive to create and maintain. But those darn users, they often want or need to do it without paying directly. The websites fund themselves with ads, but the advertisers can only afford to pay for humans to see the ads rather than robots. Right. Right. This creates a need for human users to prove to the websites they're human. Sometimes through chat has like challenges or logins. Yep. So that's, show me the, so that's, I'm not a robot thing, it's not a security thing. It's to make sure that that's an eyeball. Looking at that ad, oh my God, that drives me nuts. Here's another example. There are

Stacey Higginbotham (01:11:32):
People you can hire to, like, you can screw your competitors over by hiring companies to click on their ads.

Leo Laporte (01:11:40):
This is more of a Google problem than a you and me problem. Yeah. This is Google's, Google's problem is ad, you know, click fraud. Mm-Hmm. and, and you know, advertisers rightly say to Google, well, you know, you say that 400 people clicked that ad, but, or saw that ad. That's how they bill. But did they, are they human? So that's a, this is why Google's worried about this. Users wanna know they're interacting with real people on social websites. Okay. This is more our okay in our Bailey wick. But bad actors often wanna promote posts with fake engagement to promote products, make a news story seem more important, get it, get your favorite guy. Elected websites can only show users what content is popular with real people. If websites are able to know the difference between a trusted and untrusted environment, okay, here's another scenario.

(01:12:29):
Users playing a game on a website. Wanna know whether other players are using software that enforces the game Rules. Andy Cheat. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. That's a big issue in gaming, right? Right. Users sometimes get this a fourth scenario, users sometimes get tricked into installing malicious software because it imitates software like their banking apps to steal from users. The bank's internet interface could protect those users if it could establish that the request it's getting are actually coming from the bank or other trustworthy software. So you might say, you know, you're going around and somebody says, Hey, I just got the latest fast pay app. It's called, you know, Zo and use it. And it might be draining your bank account without you knowing mm-hmm. <Affirmative> the bank should know this is not real. Right. This is not legit. So it's really, again, getting down to kind of authentication the trust relationship between websites and clients.

(01:13:21):
It's frequently established through the collection interpretation of highly re identifiable information. Cookies, cookies, cookies. However, this is all about cookies. Huh? It's all about, this is Google. Remember Google did a whole bunch of different stuff. Remember the coat? Flock, flock. Remember that. They're trying like hell to, to, to support advertising on the web. 'cause It's, what is it? 79% of the business is their money without pissing off US users. Yeah. The trust relationship. They write between, this is all Google explaining it. The trust relationships between websites and clients is frequently established through the collection interpretation of a highly information. However, the signals that are considered essential for these safety use cases can also serve as, here's the insight some bozo had as a near unique fingerprint that can be used to track users across sites without their knowledge or control. We've heard a lot about fingerprinting and this is one of the reasons I thought in the long run, Google didn't mind losing cookies because they knew there are better ways to identify us as we travel around the web with, well, Leo, is this

Ant Pruitt (01:14:27):
Just for Google or is this for everywhere where Google serves ads across most of the, like is this

Leo Laporte (01:14:34):
Standard known universe standard with the web environment integrity. A p i websites will be able to request a token, I guess from me that, that, that attest key facts about the environment their client code is running in. For example, this a p I will show that a user is operating a web client on a secure Android device. Tampering with the attestation will be prevented by signing the tokens cryptographically. This is just a, a unique identifier. Yeah. This is just a fingerprint. Websites will ultimately decide if they trust the verdict returned from the at tester. It is expected the at testers would typically come from the operating system. As a matter of practicality. Imagine this will be built into Android post-haste. However, the, this explainer does not prescribe that. Okay. So they don't say how it's gonna happen. Multiple operating systems may choose to use the same at tester.

Ant Pruitt (01:15:33):
Sounds like it's just wait and see and then be ready to hit opt out.

Leo Laporte (01:15:37):
Well, we may not be able to opt out. They're building it into Chrome. There's a tension between, oh, utility for anti-fraud cases requiring deterministic verdicts and high coverage. And the risk of websites using this functionality to exclude specific at testers or non-attest browsers. We look forward. In other words, I'm on Firefox. I'm on, it doesn't do that. Well, we, you can't come in. We look forward to discussion on this topic. <Laugh>. So basically, would

Stacey Higginbotham (01:16:02):
It be better, I wonder could you also use it? Wait, could you also use it to keep people from countries that you don't wanna see your content out?

Leo Laporte (01:16:09):
Sure. Absolutely.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:16:10):
That's interesting.

Leo Laporte (01:16:11):
Yeah. So, 'cause you know, you get IP addresses, but that's not a hundred percent reliable because of VPNs and so forth. But if every machine had a unique identifiable fingerprint and maybe then <laugh>, so then

Stacey Higginbotham (01:16:22):
You could also, you could, if you were like a men's rights group, maybe you'd be like, you know what if someone's a woman, I don't wanna

Leo Laporte (01:16:29):
Come to my site. No girls allowed <laugh>.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:16:32):
That would be really interesting.

Leo Laporte (01:16:34):
So the goals according to Google, are to allow web servers, the sites you visit to evaluate the authenticity of the device. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> the thing you're using to visit it with and an honest representation of the software stack, your browser, your operating system and traffic from the device. You could see why that's something they would want. But this is, this is what advertisers have always want. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, this is what cookies were being used for. Offers an adversarily robust and long-term sustainable anti-abuse solution. That's what you were talking about. Stacy. Don't enable new cross site user tracking capabilities. Okay. Through attestation. Continue to allow web browsers to browse the web without attestation, so you wouldn't have to use it. That's, you know, this is, this is the replacement for flock. That's a, you nailed it. Which was replace for cookies. Right? here's from Apple Insider, maybe something, you know, they're talking to a fifth grader, so maybe this will be a little bit, 'cause you know, apple users <laugh>

Ant Pruitt (01:17:37):
Just wrong.

Leo Laporte (01:17:40):
Google might not be completely ready to give up website cookies just yet, but the company is certainly investigating alternatives like a user tracking ad platform built into Chrome <laugh>. That's, that's a little more to the point, isn't it? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And of course they're dressing it up with all of these security and attestation of who you are. You

Ant Pruitt (01:18:00):
Read all of that and I was thinking, boy, this sounds like a privacy concern. Yeah. Right here. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:18:07):
It's, it's four Google employees authored it but it's already prototyped within Chrome. No wide launch has been announced or even hinted at yet.

Ant Pruitt (01:18:18):
When you say Chrome, does that necessarily mean like Chromium project? The actual

Leo Laporte (01:18:22):
No, I don't think so. Okay. 'cause I think I don't, well, I don't think so. But because

Ant Pruitt (01:18:26):
Then you have other browsers out there using Yeah. Chromium.

Leo Laporte (01:18:30):
This is a company that 79% had supported trying desperately to find a way that doesn't, that users don't hate. I

Ant Pruitt (01:18:38):
Like how you say desperately when we just talked about the billions of dollars, they Well,

Leo Laporte (01:18:43):
Yeah. But they're really afraid of ads author. Right. They wanna protect it. Yeah. And again,

Jeff Jarvis (01:18:47):
It's not just Google. It's every site upon which Google serves ads.

Leo Laporte (01:18:52):
Here's somebody on Hacker News says, I've been thinking carefully about this. I really don't what to say. It's absolutely heartbreaking watching something I really care about Die by a thousand Cuts. Google will just strong arm them implementation through chromium. Oh, okay. And when banks and Netflix, et cetera, start using it, they've effectively cornered the other engines into implementing it. You know, it's a problem. Right Now, I use Firefox on Linux often can't watch videos. Right. for instance, I couldn't watch Netflix on it. Right. Because the d r m isn't, you know, they, they, they don't get their D R M protection. Yeah. So that's where the D r M connection,

Ant Pruitt (01:19:24):
Back in the days, you used to have to have silver light. Remember that? Oh, right. Yeah. Geez.

Leo Laporte (01:19:29):
Memories. This is what they did with flock. People didn't like flock. So <laugh>, this is, this is the replacement. What cookies were

Jeff Jarvis (01:19:39):
A fairly benign thing. All in all. And everybody demonized cookies and it keeps getting

Leo Laporte (01:19:43):
Worse. Yeah. This is worse than cookies.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:19:45):
Yeah. Well, no, no. Okay. Hold up. Okay. We demonized cookies because we were like, the heck is happening because up until cookies, we didn't realize or have something that tracked us forever across everything we did in a place. Like, it's like

Leo Laporte (01:19:59):
Cookies are intrusive. No, we've acclimated to them. No, no. The original spec for cookies was not intrusive. Right. It specifically said then Firefox or Mozilla, which created these specifically said there's no cross site tracking. If a cookie's issued by Starbucks, Pete's cant see Starbucks cookies. This is where it became a problem. Because Facebook being the tracking genius, as they are said, well, but if we put a Facebook thumbs up like button on every site, then it can be a first party cookie. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, it can be from Facebook loophole, and we can, every site that has the Facebook thumbs up is, is for that thumb a Facebook site. So it can say, oh, he's on the Starbucks site. Oh, he is on the pizza site. Everybody uses it, right? Yeah. So it's cross site tracking cookies that are the problem. And you can turn that off.

(01:20:46):
You just turn off third party cookies. Every browser does it. And that won't work anymore. And I, you know, I mean, I use Firefox and a Firefox will sandbox the Facebook thumbs up for that reason. It'll isolate it or prevent it from working. So there are ways to do to, to stop that. Cookies are necessary though. Cookies are, well, yeah. Log, that's log stateless internet. It's the only way to get state. Yeah. If you want, don't wanna log in every single time you go to Facebook. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, you better have a cookie. Yeah. Right. So

Stacey Higginbotham (01:21:15):
Let me, let me pull that back and say tracking pixels,

Leo Laporte (01:21:19):
Sorry. Oh, tracking. And I agree with you. Tracking pixels. Ah, okay. And this is just the problem with tracking pixels Google says is, well, we can't be sure it's a human. So we've got an even better way of doing it, which is a fingerprinting technique, which basically attest you are Leo LaPorte. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, and, you know, just like flock. They'll say, oh, but it's anonymous. Yeah. We've anonymous it. It doesn't say you're Leo LaPorte, it's just you're 1 7 4 9, 3 through three. Oh, we don't know who that is. Right. Because, because

Stacey Higginbotham (01:21:44):
We'll go back to Google as a B two B company. Right. And you are,

Leo Laporte (01:21:49):
It's product. We're a C, right? We don't <laugh>. No, we're

Ant Pruitt (01:21:52):
A p the product

Leo Laporte (01:21:53):
Peon. Anyway yeah. I'm glad we spent some time on that. I I did. Steve talked about it. Yes. I was so confused about it. Yeah. I didn't really understand it. But this is their replacement for flock and you know, I think they are somewhat trying to make it more confusing and, and obfuscated so that you don't really, they did a good job of that, I'd say. Yeah. And good on people like Ron Amadio for reading it and saying, whoa, hold on. This is a nightmare. It's a D R M gatekeeper for the web.

Ant Pruitt (01:22:23):
How soon will our local leadership get involved with this and, and pull them up to Congress and have them testify, Hey, what

Leo Laporte (01:22:30):
Is this? It's too complicated for Congress. This is what they realize. If we make this look, look how hard it was for us to figure out what the hell it was. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Exactly. Members of Congress go, ah, yeah, fine. Why? I, I I

Ant Pruitt (01:22:41):
Don't like this Google. It just makes no sense. We need, we need you to stop this.

Leo Laporte (01:22:45):
That's probably what happened to Mitch McConnell started reading this and <laugh> just froze. Oh, that was sad. It is sad. I don't know. I Yeah, though it was very sad.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:22:55):
I mean,

Leo Laporte (01:22:56):
Yeah. No, and I wish him nothing, but but health and get better. I'm not a fan of his politics. Mm-Hmm. But that's Yeah. Still a human. Yeah, he's a human. That's right. Maybe he comes out of it and says, oh, <laugh>, everything I've been doing is completely wrong and screwed up. I woke up, oh, Elaine, let's get outta here. Perhaps the most telling line of the explainer says, Ron, it takes inspiration from existing native attestation signals, such as Apple's apple test and the Android play integrity. A p i. Well, that's the other interesting part of this is what is Apple doing? Where Apple contends it's the privacy company, but Apple plays a part in this. Well, but see, this is, yeah. So, and this is how Google's dressing it up too, is it's for security as well. That's why they mentioned you don't want it's anti cheat.

(01:23:46):
It makes sure you're human mm-hmm. <Affirmative> that it's not malware that's logging into your bank. It's really, you, you see all the good things you get from this. And all of that's true. And Apple's doing the same thing. You know, we wanna make sure that the phone integrity has not been breached. You know, the play integrity, a p i tells you if your device has been rooted. Right? Yeah. And so if it's been rooted, it's, it's presumably not secured, not secure. Apple's, same thing. It's been jailbroken. Well, you can't trust it now. It, it kind of, it, it, it's, but I get that it's good for business. I get that. It's good for you. Yeah. I get why they would say it's not secure since this is interesting.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:24:29):
Yeah. Well, in keeping everything secure is going to make it utterly inconvenient and terrible to use. Right. Just like keeping everything completely private destroys some of the benefits of the like mm-hmm. That's why these are such hard policy discussions is because every, it's all on a spectrum and everybody's place on that spectrum and comfort is different.

Leo Laporte (01:24:48):
Lewis Rossman, who is of course the right to repair guy, he's a New York City, or used to be a New York City repair guy who did great videos of him fixing stuff, immediately got on YouTube. God, God bless him. This is where YouTube really is great. And said, we gotta make sure this fails. This is a terrible idea and we gotta make sure this fails. He also called it d r m, but d r m I don't think really says it. It really is fingerprinting. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. Yeah. It really is. That's, that's a big difference. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Let's see, what else? A lot of talk about AI safety. The White House has an AI safety agreement. I wanna hear Stacy cut that to ribbons. Voluntary commitments leading. You can't I AI companies to manage the risks posed by ai. The only question is, did they identify the correct risks? The companies are Amazon Anthropic, Google Inflection, meta, Microsoft, and Open ai. And they have, they did not voluntarily said, for the most part, probably in all likelihood gonna agree to this. Right.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:25:57):
It's not finding Yeah. Anytime. I

Leo Laporte (01:25:58):
Mean, there's no penalty

Stacey Higginbotham (01:25:59):
Anytime the government or gets together and is like, Hey, everybody big already in this industry and has some vested interests. Come here. Let's build a regulatory program. Just, just look usance. Right. Just look Usance. It's ne it's like call in the telcos and being like, how would you like us to regulate you? And they're gonna be like, very lightly or not at all. <Laugh>,

Leo Laporte (01:26:20):
Or, or even better, let's pull up the ladder and keep anybody else from playing. Right. Right,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:26:27):
Right. Well, and really it's not at all because these are all things that they've decided are gonna be good for them and best, so. Right. You know. Sure.

Leo Laporte (01:26:35):
It's regulatory. But, but your, to your question, Leo, the categories are, at least the categories discuss, they sound right. So the seven leading AI companies you mentioned, agreed. They're committing, they're pinky swearing <laugh> that they will ensure products are safe before introducing 'em to the public, whatever that means. Sure.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:26:56):
How

Leo Laporte (01:26:58):
They commit to internal and secure internal and external security testing of the AI systems by independent experts biosecurity, cybersecurity and broader societal effects will be monitored. The companies commit to sharing information across industry and with government, civil society and academia on managing AI risks. I think the devil's in the details though. What are the risks? Are the risks that the AI Borg is gonna take over and we'll all be in assimilated? Or is it that black people are gonna have to end up going to jail in a much higher percentage because they'll be misidentified by face recognition technology? Those are two very different levels of risk.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:27:40):
There's the risk side, and then there's also, how do you get access? Do you have to be somehow certified or like part of like an established institution to get access? Do you have to pay money? Oh,

Leo Laporte (01:27:49):
Like,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:27:50):
Hey sir is open, but you have to pay a lot of money to get to it. Right.

Leo Laporte (01:27:54):
That's a very good point. That's that, that's that regulatory capture thing. Building systems that put security first. This company's commit to investing in cybersecurity. Isn't that redundant? And it's, it seems like the same thing. <Laugh>. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:28:08):
Well, there's, ah, yeah. I don't know if they're talking about cybersecurity versus privacy versus

Leo Laporte (01:28:12):
Cybersecurity. They say cybersecurity and inside threat, insider threat safeguards to pro protect proprietary and unreleased model weights. We certainly wouldn't wanna release these to the public. <Laugh>. You what the heck? This is not That could be, can we go back to the White House relate and say that's not what we want. We want them to be public with their model weights. Right?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:28:35):
Well, you may not. It depends on, I mean, like, there are like, I don't know if you're building a new missile targeting system. Okay. Maybe you don't want, I I mean, I, again, I was not in the room where that was happening, so don't know what everyone's issues are. But

Leo Laporte (01:28:51):
I mean, we know that's, again, one of the things that happened at Open AI is they said, oh no, we're gonna do this in open and we're gonna do it public. And as soon as they started being a, all of a sudden profits closed the door. Yeah. Well, we aren't gonna tell how to check.

Jeff Jarvis (01:29:01):
Well, but the regulators in Europe are trying to shut down open source versions.

Leo Laporte (01:29:04):
Yeah. Where'd you get this information from? Well, you know, that's fair to ask that question.

Jeff Jarvis (01:29:08):
Well, no, no. They're doing the opposite in Europe where they're trying to shut down open source so that they know who made what. Okay.

Leo Laporte (01:29:14):
Which is

Jeff Jarvis (01:29:14):
Exactly the

Leo Laporte (01:29:15):
Wrong way to go. Yeah. Maybe. I mean, I guess if they're afraid that a bunch of people

Ant Pruitt (01:29:19):
Story that I've been hearing about cyber resiliency.

Jeff Jarvis (01:29:22):
No, it's more just evil ai. Oh.

Leo Laporte (01:29:24):
Companies commit to facilitating third party discovery and reporting of vulnerabilities. This is a lot about cybersecurity. It's interesting. Oh, here's one. Earning the public's trust. We commit to earning, we're gonna

Jeff Jarvis (01:29:36):
Destroy you all. Do you trust us to do that?

Leo Laporte (01:29:39):
The companies commit to developing robust technical mechanisms to ensure that if lasers are employed by ai, there will be a cutoff

Jeff Jarvis (01:29:48):
Switch. Huh?

Leo Laporte (01:29:51):
No. The users know when, if we give

Stacey Higginbotham (01:29:53):
The AI a paperclip factory, we will

Jeff Jarvis (01:29:55):
Not

Leo Laporte (01:29:56):
Ask

Ant Pruitt (01:29:56):
Them to make with paper

Jeff Jarvis (01:29:57):
Clips.

Leo Laporte (01:29:58):
The companies commit to letting users

Jeff Jarvis (01:30:00):
Know staplers. They'll make staplers

Leo Laporte (01:30:02):
When content is AI generated, such as a watermarking system

Jeff Jarvis (01:30:07):
That got a lot of attention. It did. And I think that everybody can salute that flag. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>.

Leo Laporte (01:30:13):
Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (01:30:14):
Provenance is, except

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:14):
That how are they gonna do it?

Jeff Jarvis (01:30:16):
That's the question.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:17):
Because they just like, there's now research out there, there's actually some really disturbing research. One is the research that AI can't tell when something is AI generated. And then did you see the Stan, was it Stanford scientist talking about how G P T has gone from like a 96% accuracy down to 2% accuracy over the last few months?

Jeff Jarvis (01:30:37):
Yeah. Accuracy about that study. I can't figure out accuracy of what, of, of, of, of certain test math. Right. Stacy

Leo Laporte (01:30:44):
Math, it was test math bad. Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (01:30:46):
Yeah. Yikes. Because as they updated one thing, it got better at the SS a t verbal and worse at the s a t mouth <laugh> staring,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:30:54):
Which is what happens when you're, you're trying to get better on things. It's core,

Jeff Jarvis (01:30:58):
You read too much heavyweight, it's corpor and es your,

Leo Laporte (01:31:02):
Don't ask me that. Two plus two, the companies commit to publicly reporting their AI systems capabilities, limitations in areas of appropriate and inappropriate use

Jeff Jarvis (01:31:11):
That covers kind of

Leo Laporte (01:31:12):
Everything, both security risks and societal risks, such as the effect on fairness and bias. Okay. Companies commit to prioritizing research on the societal risk that AI systems can pose, including avoiding harmful bias and discrimination. Oh, this one's for use Stacey and protecting privacy. So they do admit, at least talk about it. Comp pinky swears companies commit to develop and deploy advanced AI systems to help address society's greatest challenges. <Laugh>, why are you laughing from cancer prevention to mitigating climate change.

Ant Pruitt (01:31:49):
Okay.

Leo Laporte (01:31:50):
This all, it's odine. It's all fine. Right? Of course. I was gonna

Ant Pruitt (01:31:53):
Say, all of this is sounds great, but what happens if nobody follows this stuff? There's no mention, there's no penalty penalty. No penalty fines. Punish, literally

Stacey Higginbotham (01:32:03):
Punish nothing. Nothing.

Ant Pruitt (01:32:04):
Oh, this is another list of platitude craps

Jeff Jarvis (01:32:07):
From the white. Yeah. That's the right question to me. To me, the model is, we talked about this before. It's the Federal Trade Commission model. Yeah. If you warrant to do something and you fail at that duty, right. Then we hold you liable for defrauding people. That's the way I think it ought to operate. But you need more spec specificity Yeah. In these, Stacey, is there any topic left out here?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:32:27):
Oh gosh, I don't know. I mean, oh, okay. Well, so sorry. I'm like, what mean

Jeff Jarvis (01:32:33):
To put you on the spot

Leo Laporte (01:32:34):
In there. What happens to No, I'm, I was stochastic parrots. Where do they come in? Well, no, I

Stacey Higginbotham (01:32:38):
Was just thinking with this and with other, like AI with, you know, more data coming from connected devices about people we're talking about trying to regulate things at a very high level. And I think we need to move to an outcome-based regulation. And I know that sucks. It's the worst. But

Ant Pruitt (01:32:58):
That's like we're talking about re waiting basically, right? Is what you're saying?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:33:01):
No, we could say no. I'm saying we can look forward in saying we, we could do a couple things. I think it's important to put audit mechanisms in place to understand what's happening and to whom, right? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, we could also say, look, 'cause you, there, there are certain, like when we talk about cyber stick or not having open models, there are cases where we don't want our models and weights to be open. There are cases when we do okay, we need to actually go in and establish probably not through legislation. It'll probably be a regulatory thing. And every government body probably will have to figure this out on their own. Like what matters for

Ant Pruitt (01:33:35):
Their, for whatever their jurisdiction expertise. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:33:38):
But we're gonna have to make those rules on a, not a case by case basis, but on a, a maybe indus industry specific basis. Maybe it'll be like, and, and, and I, I think this is gonna be really hard for us, especially because we have a congress that can't act and we have regulatory bodies that are mm-hmm. <Affirmative> really beholden to the companies that regulate. But

Leo Laporte (01:34:03):
You've seen what happens. I remember in the early days of the internet that Congress is reluctant to regulate it. Remember Amazon didn't pay sales tax right. For a long time. Right. 'cause it was a nascent technology and let's not regulate it. Let's see how the baby develops before we tie it down with

Jeff Jarvis (01:34:20):
Rules. It wasn't wrong. I think

Leo Laporte (01:34:21):
It wasn't wrong. As long as you're willing to regulate later. Eventually Amazon did end up paying sales taxes in every state.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:34:27):
I, I think that's the wrong way to go about something like this. For two reasons. One, this is already infiltrated. AI is not new. I'm so sorry to tell y all this. Oh yeah. Yeah. We have been we have been making data-driven and analytics-based decisions for quite some time. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. And so one, we have a sense of where the problems are. We have actually seen them. So it now in probably a couple years ago was the time to start. And then two, the big issue is it takes us so long to make regulations. The F T C saw this happening in 2013. They called for congress, actually it was 2015 when they issued the report. They started the report in 2013. They called for regulations around ai. We are 10 years later and we've got nothing. And I don't see it happening. So, and it's fine to be like, oh, we'll let it go for a while. But technology boosts much faster. Legislation takes much longer. Right. And it also has a greater impact on people's lives. And so I don't think that's an okay thing to say anymore or to even espouse really.

Jeff Jarvis (01:35:39):
But also Stacey, isn't it the case given all of that, to think that the legislation and regulation can be very specific is probably not possible. And we need frameworks. This is to, to more flexible frameworks to regulate in response to things that happen as they happen.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:35:59):
Congress needs to give each agency the power, like the Congressional authority to do their own individual ai like to establish AI bureaus within like the Department of Defense, the E P A. Okay. mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. And they also need to give each of those regulatory agencies the legal authority to do audits and to f and to do enforcement, which is fines or whatever. However they wanna enforce this preach. And right now they don't have that. And the, those are the things you need to do because I preach

Jeff Jarvis (01:36:34):
It. I have to talk about law. Right. In fact, it can't come out the whole cloth now.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:36:37):
That's the congressional thing. Yeah. Congress has to say, you have the enforcement to regulate AI in your bailiwick, bailiwick, bailiwick bailiwick you. And you have, what is

Jeff Jarvis (01:36:47):
It in Latin? I'm sure it's something else.

Leo Laporte (01:36:49):
It's ra what? <Laugh>

Jeff Jarvis (01:36:52):
Bailey. Wick

Leo Laporte (01:36:54):
Bailey Bailiwick.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:36:55):
Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:36:55):
It sounds medieval. Like there was a castle and in front of the castle there was the bailiwick and you had to go through the bailiwick to get into the moat, into the <laugh>.

Jeff Jarvis (01:37:05):
And there was the master to

Stacey Higginbotham (01:37:07):
Get into the moat. <Laugh>. Anyway,

Leo Laporte (01:37:11):
Bailiwick. One sphere of operations. A district. Oh, it comes from the word bail or bailiff.

Jeff Jarvis (01:37:17):
Oh, so there was a person. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:37:19):
Yeah. There was old middle. It comes from the middle English word for bailiff.

Jeff Jarvis (01:37:24):
Don't you just love these asides audience? Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:37:26):
This, this, these ent,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:37:28):
This entomological

Leo Laporte (01:37:29):
Asides d moments of the

Jeff Jarvis (01:37:31):
Show, corpora and bailiwick. That's our theme today.

Leo Laporte (01:37:35):
The second middle half of bailiwick comes from a middle English word for dwelling placer village wick which comes from the Latin vaus, which also means village. So Bailey, combining a bailiff with Village Vic <laugh>, you get Bailey Wick, the special domain of the Bailiff. <Laugh>. Thank you. It takes a bailiwick <laugh>. Okay. To raise mashed potatoes. Winning so far. Okay. With the show title, what's mashed potatoes? Capor and bailiwick. Yes. Kapor and Bailey Wick. Yeah. It sounds like a law firm. I would, it does witch trust them. And Jones and Jones Korra and Bailey Wick and Jones <laugh>. That's your service. Say No. It used to be a fan, a much fancier name. I would say at this point, I think it's worthwhile for government to say, let's put a pin in it. Let this thing go forward a little bit. I don't buy into the fear that like, well, they're already doing that.

(01:38:31):
You're fine. Yeah. We're safe. That's what they're doing. Yeah. I mean, I don't want them to rush, because I don't think we're in a rush. They're not. Yeah. Well, I know they're not, they're not rushing to do anything except find UFOs. Well, thank goodness. Geez. here's a great, the problem is article, which I think Jeff put in. Let's this add this to the stew. This is write up your bailiwick <laugh> chat Stew bailiwick in the, he is a fine attorney. Stew bailiwick of Bailiwick Corpora Jones. I remember him. <Laugh> Nature Magazine. Article about chat. G P T. The title does not tell you what it's about. That what it's really saying is, and something we've said a long time, AI can do some things really surprisingly well and other things it's terrible at, right? Right. This isn't new to any of us.

(01:39:22):
In a test consisting of a series of brightly colored blocks arranged in a screen, most people can spot the connecting patterns. Chat. G p t four and the search engine binging get barely one third of the puzzles right? In one category of patterns, as little as 3%, in other words, completely baffled in another goes on to talk a about the two camps. And this, this is why I bring this up. 'cause This is relevant to regulation. If we can't even understand what it's doing or how it works, how are you gonna regulate it, right? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So there are two camps of researchers, according to this nature article, that have opposing views about what's going on under the hood of LLMs. And they're quoting a cognitive science at a scientist at Harvard. Tomer Ulman. Some attribute the algorithm's achievements to glimmers of reasoning. No. Oh, or understanding says professor Ulman, others, including Ulman himself, are much more cautious. There are very good, smart people on all sides of this debate. The reason for the split, he says, is lack of conclusive evidence, supporting either opinion. There's, there's no, there's, there's no way of knowing what's going on inside. It is kind of a black box, but tests like that, those logic puzzles can real reveal the differences between humans and AI systems. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But wouldn't,

Ant Pruitt (01:40:53):
Is it, it, the whole story behind these models is they can learn over time. Is it safe to say that eventually these logic puzzles could

Leo Laporte (01:41:01):
Eventually be solved? Remember the quote we had from a few weeks ago, which is the easy stuff is hard and the hard stuff's easy. Yeah. Stuff we, well, this is, you know, like a baby can recognize it's it's mom's face at the age of, you know, yeah. Six months

Ant Pruitt (01:41:14):
Just can't tie issues hard didn't play on a tablet. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (01:41:17):
Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:41:18):
Well that's, that's part of this human bias that we have for measuring things like intelligence. Well, we talked about that in book club. Remember? Ant

Ant Pruitt (01:41:27):
Wait a minute. Depends on the book.

Leo Laporte (01:41:29):
Was it cla <laugh>?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:41:30):
This the one you didn't like? Oh. But so, so we're, we're testing them. Like, are they as smart or do they think like we do? Because I mean, that's, that's what we wanna do right now, if a hummingbird had built an ai, it would have different tests. And I know you're like, hummingbirds can ai. Yeah. Where

Leo Laporte (01:41:48):
Does that come from?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:41:50):
I, I'm just, the point is like, where'd that come from? We're, we're measuring, we're, we're assuming these things think like we do, but they don't. Right. They think like something completely different.

Leo Laporte (01:42:04):
And if you understand what they're doing, they quote another researcher who says, if you understand what they're doing, you can easily spot an ai, you know, the Turing test? Yeah. They, they, they say, this is why the Turing test fails us. Alan Turing's proposal that if you can't tell it's a computer that it's passing the Turing test, he says, yeah, you know, you take people off the street and say, is this an AI or not? Okay. But if you take an somebody who knows what questions to ask, they can quickly break an a <laugh> an AI by taking advantage of known weaknesses of the system. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So they're quoting a guy named Charlotte. Lemme see what his, where he fraise sole software engineer at Google based in Seattle. Solei says he'd find it easy to detect an L L M by taking advantage of known weaknesses of the system.

(01:42:56):
If you put me in a situation where you asked me, am I chatting to an L L M right now, I would definitely be able to tell you. But that's because he's trained as opposed to the somebody off the street. The key is, he says, to take the l l m outside of its comfort zone. Hmm. Give it scenarios that are variations on ones. The l l m will have seen a lot in his training data. In many cases, the l l m answers by spitting out words that are most likely to be associated with a question and knows the answer to, rather, this is where that hallucination comes in, rather than the correct answer to something that's related, but not the same. Anyway, it's very interesting. It, but the, the reason I bring it up is, is this article in, in Nature kind of set, tells me why it's hard to regulate this because we don't know what are we, what are we trying to prevent? You can't make a regulation and unless you know what's against the law, you're

Stacey Higginbotham (01:43:50):
Trying to prevent harms to people. Well, we, yes, but

Leo Laporte (01:43:53):
You're

Stacey Higginbotham (01:43:53):
Trying to prevent an AI from, this is why the audit section is important. You're trying to prevent ais that unfairly don't identify black people correctly.

Leo Laporte (01:44:04):
But how do you identify that ai

Stacey Higginbotham (01:44:07):
You say to, you don't need to identify the ai. You say, Hey, if you're, you say to a police state police municipality, or you you say, Hey, when you're using this for, you know, either for evidence or to bring a person in, you have to disclose it in the warrant. Yeah. You have to disclose. You can't do that secretive. Oh,

Leo Laporte (01:44:27):
And then let humans, then you have to judge. Yes. Yes. Whether that evidence is valid Yes. Is yes, that's a good idea. Yeah, I agree with

Jeff Jarvis (01:44:35):
That. I think that's the, that's the issue. It's the same issue with the schmuck lawyer. Right. He, he asked a machine, it gave a wrong answer, but he didn't follow up with any of his responsibilities.

Leo Laporte (01:44:43):
He was the guy I worked for Bailey with ez.

Jeff Jarvis (01:44:46):
That's, that's where he is gonna work now,

Leo Laporte (01:44:48):
<Laugh> okay. So instead of, so what you have to do is build in protections. Is that what you're, you

Stacey Higginbotham (01:44:58):
Have to build in a per, you have to build in a judgment, a system where people make judgments and, and then have the enforcement power.

Leo Laporte (01:45:08):
But then doesn't that put you right back to where you were before you had ai?

Stacey Higginbotham (01:45:13):
Yeah. Kind of Does it basically. Well, no, it still speeds things up, right? So you

Leo Laporte (01:45:19):
Still have a tool.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:45:21):
You still have a tool, but you, you can't, you could never, I mean, you would never outsource manufacturing completely without any QA True. On a product line. Right. This is the people are the qa. So you can, people

Leo Laporte (01:45:35):
Know where the assumptions are. You

Jeff Jarvis (01:45:37):
Need methodology,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:45:38):
But you need those. Yeah. So that's the sort of thing. Congress needs to give agencies power to develop that QA and then the ability to enforce whatever the regulatory agencies deem to be the appropriate outcomes. Right. Because those people are experts. We can't let Congress get into the nitty gritty because that's not what Congress is

Leo Laporte (01:45:59):
Good at. They're not experts in it. Yeah. No,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:46:01):
They're, and, and that's, that's, and right now we've got congress like wanting to be involved because it's sexy and it's fun. But they don't actually wanna make the hard decisions. They wanna pun that to the regulatory agency. And they

Leo Laporte (01:46:14):
Should, you will approve this latest action from the F T C. They have opened an investigation of open AI to determine whether it's ai, hallucinations, harm individuals. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> by propagating potentially dangerous misinformation. That's exactly, Hmm. What you were saying. Right. But Yeah. But they could do that.

Jeff Jarvis (01:46:37):
And so who's at fault then? The machine. Hmm. Or me. I wanna make it, make this information. It's easy.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:46:44):
It's a product liability issue. And the F T C is definitely in charge of products that hurt people. Right. So you But who's hurting people? They'll have to make the ca they'll have to make the case that misinformation hurts people. Right. They have to make that case. That's what, and then they'll also have to make the ca I know, I, I'm just breaking it down for you here. <Laugh>, they have to make the case that information has caused some sort of harm. And then they have to make the case that that misinformation is uniquely associated with chat G P T and its models. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But they should have the chance and the authority to make those arguments.

Leo Laporte (01:47:21):
The interestingly, it also halts the routine document destruction operations going on at open ai. Ah, ah, ah. Usually when you destroy documents, you have something to hide and takes the ftc No, you're just cleaning up. FTC is asking them to take measures to preserve any relevant documentation. Among other things, documents the FTC wants to related to open AI's, l l M based products, their uses, use cases, how open markets these offerings. So what they tell people when they say, use this, but most importantly the F T C would like to understand in detail how or if open AI has tried to determine, and this is right up what you were saying Stacy, what impact the accuracy of its product has on users. That's part one. Part two is a privacy issue, how it retains and uses information IT collection collects. And part three, how did you train these guys? Mm-Hmm. That's the documents they're destroying, I think. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, they don't want people to know their secret sauce. You know what? Well, they

Jeff Jarvis (01:48:20):
Also don't want to know. They, they don't wanna be sued. Well, copyright

Leo Laporte (01:48:23):
Fights ahead. That's right. Washington Post obtained this document the FTC civil investigative demand. And they've given

Stacey Higginbotham (01:48:35):
I mean, if I sued you tomorrow, Leo, I would tell you to stop. I would tell your company, keep everything related to all of your communications with Stacy.

Leo Laporte (01:48:45):
Second paragraph. You must suspend any routine procedures for document destruction. Yeah. And take other measures to prevent the destruction of documents in your possession, custody, or control. So they're giving the open AI folks two weeks to schedule a meeting with the F T C to answer these questions. I think that's good. That's a, that's exactly what you

Stacey Higginbotham (01:49:04):
Were asking for. This is, this is deceptive. This is a deceptive advertising case,

Leo Laporte (01:49:08):
Right? Yeah. In a way it is.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:49:10):
Tell me why it isn't, Jeff. Let's,

Jeff Jarvis (01:49:11):
Because I could use Microsoft Word to do everything that we just discussed. Is Microsoft Word at fault or am I at fault for using it to make up crap?

Leo Laporte (01:49:19):
Well, but it's reasonable that it's

Stacey Higginbotham (01:49:21):
<Crosstalk>. But Microsoft Word doesn't tell me No. Microsoft Word isn't actually doing, you're using it, but you are actually taking, taking

Leo Laporte (01:49:27):
Action. If it's G B T, let's say it's using open AI's technology.

Jeff Jarvis (01:49:30):
Well, no, I actually,

Leo Laporte (01:49:31):
The, the question is, did open AI mislead that lawyer or mislead you in what the outcome of this use would be?

Jeff Jarvis (01:49:39):
Okay. That's that's a good example. Yeah. So the lawyer asked machine, he shouldn't have asked.

Leo Laporte (01:49:44):
Well, how was he supposed to knew that? Yeah. And

Stacey Higginbotham (01:49:45):
If, and if

Leo Laporte (01:49:46):
He used

Stacey Higginbotham (01:49:47):
Open use Microsoft,

Jeff Jarvis (01:49:47):
Well, this is where Microsoft is the one at fault. Then Microsoft putting chat t in a search environment saying, this is what you should expect from the

Leo Laporte (01:49:55):
Search. I would bet that this same letter goes after BET Microsoft. Microsoft

Jeff Jarvis (01:49:57):
Bet Microsoft be the one. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:50:00):
Yeah. I was I thought you were saying you could do it with f like with Microsoft Word. And I'd be like, and then the F FTC will come after you for deceptive. That's what I'm

Leo Laporte (01:50:07):
Saying. Yeah. Like,

Jeff Jarvis (01:50:08):
I can go to J G B T and ask it to make deceptive stuff. I could go to Microsoft Office and make up deceptive stuff. The, the, the intermediary of the tool in either case is not liable. And if, what, what I think you would argue next is what if I did know like the schmuck lawyer and it made up stuff? Well, as the judge made clear, he had multiple opportunities to just Google these cases and find out that they weren't true. But is the, and that's where the, the liability li that's why he paid

Leo Laporte (01:50:36):
5,000 bucks. Maybe they,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:50:37):
Yeah. And, and there, there's such a thing is like two parties having liability and it not being equal. Right? I mean, like, this is like Tesla's auto

Leo Laporte (01:50:47):
Of self driving. Auto pilot.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:50:48):
Exactly. Self-driving.

Jeff Jarvis (01:50:50):
Exactly. But the judge made clear,

Leo Laporte (01:50:51):
This is a case word

Jeff Jarvis (01:50:51):
In that case that the, he made very clear that the chat G P t wasn't at all at fault. He made clear it was the lawyer who screwed up 'cause the lawyer, but

Leo Laporte (01:50:59):
Made a mistake. I think lawyer,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:51:01):
The

Leo Laporte (01:51:01):
Lawyer could make a case that here's their OpenAI had a responsibility to clearly say this information could be completely made up. Is there at least is maybe doesn't

Stacey Higginbotham (01:51:15):
Also, and a lawyer has a duty of care to their client that is much higher than the average

Leo Laporte (01:51:20):
Could responsible. Both are responsible. And I think it's appropriate why for f c to go after open AI on these issues and find out and get, do some investigation. And the lawyer already has been punished. Both can be punished for that. You know,

Jeff Jarvis (01:51:33):
Notebook, LMM puts this warning all over.

Leo Laporte (01:51:36):
Yeah. All over. But that doesn't stop people from using it because there's also this drumbeat of, isn't this amazing? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, look how smart it is. Look on all the cool things it'll do. Right.

Jeff Jarvis (01:51:45):
But that's what the, again, the judge said that was your fault then, sir.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:51:49):
Well, and this is where, this is why the F TC exists against people who market things incorrect. That's right. Incorrectly. Because marketers will always tell you things are amazing.

Leo Laporte (01:51:58):
Yeah. Deceptive. Yeah. Yeah. Alright. That's a good conversation. <Laugh>. Oh, well, let's, let's take, we're a little break. Let's take a little break. We wanna do a change log here. And I have generated this change log. Thanks to chat G P T. Oh boy. So ladies and gentlemen, also known as Scooter X. Is that what you're talking about? Yes. Scooter X I was about to say Scooter <laugh>. Has anybody ever met Scooter X in person? Do we know? No. No. This is true. This

Jeff Jarvis (01:52:24):
Is true. And he has the suspicious X. His

Leo Laporte (01:52:27):
Name. His name. Oh boy. Oh, it's time for the Google change log. Craig. Craig. <Laugh> es change log. <Laugh>.

Ant Pruitt (01:52:45):
Thank you Mr. Nita. I

Leo Laporte (01:52:46):
Think we made Benita go to sleep briefly. <Laugh>. I really do. I'm sorry. Benita. Google a abandons work to move assistant smart speakers to fuchsia. And this is kind of surprising, isn't it? Stacy fia, which is an operating system purpose built for iot. I think they already moved the Nest hub Max to Fusia, but these, apparently they're not, they're not gonna move the speakers to Fusia.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:53:13):
So this and Ruth RA's new gig make me feel like there's a lot of doubt that Google's gonna continue making these sort of devices. I feel I'm a little worried about it

Leo Laporte (01:53:23):
Killed by Google. Well, we learned a couple months ago that Amazon had lost billions on Alexa. Google must be losing millions too. I mean, at at least Amazon you can lost. Well,

Stacey Higginbotham (01:53:33):
There are other Betts only made other Betts is what this whole division's under. And they made 285 million and they lost. I don't know if they put out their loss, but yeah, this is not a big business.

Leo Laporte (01:53:47):
Last year, according to nine to five, Google, Google's fuchsia team had renewed its efforts to support smart speakers. The team had experimented with a single speaker, ditched that effort. <Laugh> then restored it later on. They were working on multiple speakers. In fact, they were working on an as yet unreleased speaker, equipped with U W B ultra wideband, which is interesting. According to the s o c manufacturer AM logic, which makes the chip in these guys fuchsia was on track to replace the underlying cast os of speakers like the Nest audio. They had already done that with Nest Hub, but now they're changing horses in the middle of the stream. Fuchsia team on the GitHub code repository firmly marked all of its speaker hardware as unsupported and removed the related code. Wow.

Ant Pruitt (01:54:46):
A scooter X says an I R C chip issue.

Leo Laporte (01:54:49):
Maybe. Maybe. Or maybe just a waste of effort.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:54:53):
Well, you do, like when you wanna the architecture.

Ant Pruitt (01:54:56):
Oh, sorry.

Stacey Higginbotham (01:54:56):
No, well, I was gonna say, it could be like not enough. Memory is part of the original. They couldn't do it. Like, you know when you're gonna Oh yeah. You, you gotta store everything you had. Right. Bring the new OSS in and then swap it over. And that's double the memory requirements. Let me say

Leo Laporte (01:55:10):
This right now. Ruth, keep your hands off. Chrome <laugh>. Chrome oss. Okay. Thank you <laugh>. And gimme a new Chromebook while you're asking. Well, I'm, that's asking too much. Yeah,

Ant Pruitt (01:55:22):
You and this little torque computer over here next to me is cute. Hey, just <laugh>,

Leo Laporte (01:55:27):
What do you, Hey, what is that?

Ant Pruitt (01:55:29):
Look at that. Isn't it cute?

Leo Laporte (01:55:31):
I forgot to ask. Are you using, is that an A, sir? What are you using? No, it's Pixel go. Oh, the old go. It's the old go. Yeah. Yeah. Google Play Services ending support for Android. 4.4 ayy. Yay. That's we're at Android. 14 is imminent. So that's pretty old. That's Kit Kat. 10 years old in August. So, you know, if you have a phone based on Kit Katt, maybe time to look at it. Yeah. It's time for another phone. I did order, we didn't even mention the Samsung event at 4:00 AM our time this morning. They announced, of course, the fold five, the flip five, the new Samsung watches, new Samsung tablets. I ordered a flip five 'cause I know Stacey needs a new phone. <Laugh> <laugh>. Actually, Lisa's very interested in looking at it too, but she says, I wish Apple would do this a fold.

(01:56:25):
Yeah. And they may really, you know, I mean, pixel's doing, Google's doing one now. So but the fold five looks pretty good. It's got the chip set, same chip set as the S 23 Ultra. This is the first time I've heard of any this today. I totally forgot about Samsung. Yeah, I know. 'cause It was early in the morning. They flew a bunch of people out there. Lance Ooff was there. Carolina Nessy. She was there. She was there. Who was it on the show? Oh from Windows Central Rubino was there, right? Yeah. Daniel Rubino. They flew these people out to South Korea, where it's about 800 degrees and a hundred percent humidity. And they were there at this event. I don't, another day in Georgia. Yeah. <laugh>. It's anyway I will have it August 11th. So I will have it for the following Wednesday.

(01:57:14):
And I'll, I'll give you my review. I've had it for almost a week by then. And I, I'll give you my review. But, you know, it looks like they've made, made significant improvements to the hinge, the screen and mostly to the screen on the o outside of that thing. The one you have, Stacy's just got a little tiny screen. They're gonna have a screen that fills up the, the whole house. Nice. So it should be more usable. So maybe that's what you should replace your Kit Kat Android phone with Chrome OS one 15 rolling out. Do you have it yet, Jeff? I don't know. Android app streaming PDF signatures. Bunch of new features. P what's this? Pdf d f signature. You can now that you, the P d F reader on your Chromebook, when you open PDFs in the gallery app, there's a signature tool.

(01:58:03):
So you can sign, add your signature. Oh, I like that. Yeah. No, I've got one 14. Oh, that's, that's pretty cool. So it's coming soon. Restart should release. That is handy. 'cause I use Dropbox and Hello Sign. Right. Yeah. Hello Sign. I pay for Adobe to do that. Right? I dislike can't going to a service where I have to sign into it and they take the document over. I'd rather go DocuSign or something like that. Yeah. Android app streaming from your Pixel or your Shami phone running Android 13 or newer. Which is cool. So you don't have to install an Android app. You could just have your have it on for instance, threads. Yeah. Which has a nice Android app. You could run that on your, well, I Threads

Ant Pruitt (01:58:41):
Now

Leo Laporte (01:58:41):
On Yeah. As an Android. Install it as an Android app. As render app. Yeah. Now you can just stream it from the phone without installing it. Let's see, what else? Oh, and yeah, windows has added the ability to to communicate with your Android phone as well. That should Windows.

Ant Pruitt (01:59:00):
I thought that was, why would I want Windows? I thought that has been the case since 11, right?

Leo Laporte (01:59:04):
No. I think this is maybe they've slowly been rolling this out. We were talking about it on windows Weekly this week. Man, I thought they'd been talking about that. Let me find Paul's article since

Ant Pruitt (01:59:17):
Like last year.

Leo Laporte (01:59:18):
I can, I can fill you in. 'cause I, I don't have the exact details. This was part of his pick of the week here nearby share it's called. So this, this came out. So if you have a Pixel phone and a Windows machine you can just, apple does this with air plug. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative> Air, what is it? Air Airdrop Airdrop nearby share. You can send Pho. You take a picture on your phone. You can send it over, in fact to your, your windows laptop. In fact, Richard Kim was saying he was actually selling his house, going around doing a photo shoot of the house had just set up that every picture he took on his phone went immediately to his laptop. Which is, which is handy. It's

Ant Pruitt (02:00:04):
Handy.

Leo Laporte (02:00:04):
Yeah. So that's a new feature. It's a nearby share for Windows

Ant Pruitt (02:00:10):
Into Google change log

Leo Laporte (02:00:12):
In the Google change law. But, but it's

Ant Pruitt (02:00:15):
Tle. No, wait a minute. No, no. I didn't know. Close it. Don't end the Google <laugh>. Oh, that's it. Officially over.

Leo Laporte (02:00:22):
Allowed to do

Ant Pruitt (02:00:22):
More. My bad. <Laugh>. Once

Leo Laporte (02:00:28):
That, once they play that, I can's

Ant Pruitt (02:00:31):
Law

Leo Laporte (02:00:32):
The law.

Ant Pruitt (02:00:32):
The FTC is gonna come up. You, I said, you said it was over and you defrauded people by doing yet more of it.

Leo Laporte (02:00:39):
This is, believe me, you didn't miss anything. I'm just looking at the two <laugh> items we didn't do. Well, I'm

Ant Pruitt (02:00:44):
Looking at Mr. Benito in the booth. Just waiting. He's waiting. He says what pushed him away. What <laugh>

Leo Laporte (02:00:51):
Our show today. We're gonna take a break and when we come back, we will get pics and stuff. We'll be sponsor show show. They brought to you by Fast Mail. Oh, I love Fast Mail. How many times have I said this? If email's important to you, do not use free email. You get no support. You are not the customer. You're the product with Fast Mail. Email works for you the best support in the world. They treat you as a customer to be serviced and supported and cared for. Not as a product to be exploited. No advertising. In fact, the anti-spam features a fast mail are second to none. It's actually the reason for a long time I <laugh>, I would have my mail go through Gmail just for the anti-spam and then into Fast Mail. I've been using Fast Mail for more than a decade.

(02:01:39):
I finally just said, I don't need Google anymore. Fastmail does a better job. Mm-Hmm. FastMail uses Mail a sieve. And you can of course use the automatic settings very easy, but it's very powerful. I actually have a bunch of code that I use. For instance, if an email is in French or Chinese, I don't want it. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, I don't want it. Things like that, right? 'cause I can't read it. I don't know what it means. What's the point? And because my last name is LaPorte, I get a lot of French email. All the French, right? Yeah, yeah. But I, it's a simple SIV command and it's very easy if you like using your email client, of course you can keep using it. Fast Mail is real imap. In fact, they, they are part of the open source community. They use the Cyrus IMAP server and they contribute back to it.

(02:02:23):
In fact, really FastMail is a leader in the internet community. They are very active creating new standards for email, new authentication settings. Things that will end up being in all of our email often start at FastMail. If you wanna use their app, they have an app on iOS or Android. I stopped using anybody else's apps. It's fantastic. They also have a web app. So you get your choice. You can get your mail anyway you want. The FastMail web app has quick settings, which makes it easy to install a new theme or switch between mode, dark mode mode, dark mode, baby mode, change your text size without leaving the FastMail screen so you know exactly how it's gonna look. You can create a new, oh, I love the mass email addresses. So this works standalone. Or if you're using a bit warden or sponsor bit warden or one password.

(02:03:15):
When you create a password for a site, FastMail, we'll create a new unique email address which doubles the security, right? 'cause They'd have to know that unique email address as well as the password. And that address is unique for every company. Everything you sign up, which is a great way of finding out if they're selling that address on, right? Yep. you can show or hide your reading pain. You can switch between folders and labels. Well, this is another thing. You know, Gmail isn't real imap, it uses labels. IMAP uses folders. Some people prefer labels. You can switch back and forth. You can use either one on FastMail. They support both. You can auto save contacts. I do that. That way if I have an email conversation going on, that person doesn't go into spam. It goes into my important folder. 'cause I say everything, everybody in my contacts that that sends me an email that should go in an important 'cause folder.

(02:04:07):
'cause I know them. Right? Right. At the very least, that should go an important of course, I have a v I P folder. So mail from my mom and my wife and my daughter automatically go there and me, and of course, aunt Pruitt's email goes in there. <Laugh> aunt, you have your own folder. It's called Ignore <laugh>. No, no. I'm just teasing you. You, you go into v I P. Absolutely. and in fact, I even see a little picture of AMP because it supports services like a gravita. Gravita. Yeah. So puts that right in there. I use it for my calendars and contacts to forget Google. I've got it all syncing with FastMail notes too. It's great. Total privacy. Now you can add or buy a domain through FastMail. Now I've done this. I have about 20 domains that I've purchased elsewhere. Now I'm gonna buy 'em for FastMail that I have FastMail doing the D N Ss for, which gives me authenticated email from FastMail automatically they set up the records. So it works right out of the box. I just think this is the best way to have a custom domain. And by the way, you know, like I have leoville.com, anything for gets, gets sent to@leoville.com goes into that inbox. So I, another way I can use unique emails for everybody. I just, I mean, I can go on and on. I have

Ant Pruitt (02:05:22):
Gone on and on. I finally got migrated over. It took me a little while because I have my own domain and I was screwing up my d n s records, not fast mail screwing up. I

Leo Laporte (02:05:32):
Was, yeah, but once you pointed to Fast Mail, it works really

Ant Pruitt (02:05:34):
Well. So you know it have, you have to wait on things to propagate and so forth. And I finally got in touch with Fast Mail and I was like, no dude, you're doing it all wrong here. This,

Leo Laporte (02:05:42):
They have good support, don't they? Done? Love it one day. That's 'cause you're a customer. Oh, you pay for free email with your privacy. If Fast mail your data is your data better productivity features. It's, it's not expensive as little as $3 a month. I just think it's the best email in. It's totally worth it. The market. It's, I've been using it forever. I've been telling people to use it forever. You get to choose fast mail. In fact, it should be easy to take all your old data from Gmail or anywhere else, import it to your Fast Mail inbox. They're just the best. Reclaim your privacy. Boost productivity with Fast Mail. Try and get everybody to use it. Try it now free for 30 days. Fastmail.Com/Twit. Actually, my whole family uses FastMail. They just don't know it because I have laport.email. And so they get their email there and it forwards it onto whatever email service they want to use. They're going right through FastMail fastmail.com/twit. It's fantastic.

Ant Pruitt (02:06:39):
I'm so glad I got my

Leo Laporte (02:06:40):
Go ahead. Try to get some support from Gmail. Just <laugh>. It reminds me of the woman who called the radio show saying I went to ask you some Irvine. I went down to the Irvine Google office and knocked on the door <laugh>. Nobody was there.

Ant Pruitt (02:06:55):
Yeah, that's how that

Leo Laporte (02:06:55):
Works. Yeah. <laugh>. But I knocked on their door. Alright. It's so nice to have you in studio, Jeff. I'm so happy to be here. I wish you would just move out of Bedminster. You don't need to be in that guy's golf club. Just come on over to our site. There's SS thunderstorms on the east coast tomorrow, so I might just be staying over. You might be stuck. Stuck, dude. Yeah, it's all right. We got a guest room. You can do that. We're gonna go out to dinner. But actually we should say Jeff's gonna stick around and he and Jason Howell are gonna do a little AI thing in the club. Yep. So if you tune in for the Gizz, it'll be a little delayed. Jeff and Jason in the club doing ai, just getting ready for that AI show. Actually we had a great one last week with Anthony Nielsen, how we use AI here. I didn't even know half of that stuff. He just did a whole bunch of logos. Did you see those?

Ant Pruitt (02:07:43):
Yeah. Yeah, I did.

Leo Laporte (02:07:44):
All I presume it's all ai. As a

Ant Pruitt (02:07:45):
Matter of fact, I used one. They're couple, couple hours ago. We'll see it later.

Leo Laporte (02:07:49):
Alright, nice, nice. Stacy, what's your thing of the week?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:07:56):
I was gonna give y'all a new smart button, but it's not yet working, so I've gotta troubleshoot that guy. But so instead, I am gonna tell you about, this feels cheesy. This feels like I'm intruding on Ant's territory,

Ant Pruitt (02:08:10):
But I have no territory.

Leo Laporte (02:08:12):
<Laugh>.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:08:12):
Well, you'll see it's a fitness product. It's a weight

Ant Pruitt (02:08:15):
In desk. Oh, that's definitely not mine. <Laugh>.

Leo Laporte (02:08:18):
Well, no. He says Stacy blowing up his truck is very chest and showing his abs fitness focused. I did 21 pushups the other day. Yes, you did. I'm never doing another one again. I could hardly move. Wait, wait, wait, wait. Do that again. Look at those guns. Oh, Jesus. So Stacey does not have biceps like that, but she's a Pilates mess. Yes,

Ant Pruitt (02:08:37):
She is. So I want no part of this actually.

Leo Laporte (02:08:39):
Whoa, wait a minute. I that bag. Wait a minute. Wait, take that back. Stacey. Check

Stacey Higginbotham (02:08:44):
Out the tricep. Look

Leo Laporte (02:08:45):
At that. Is is that from Pilates or have you've been lifting weights? Miss Stacy, I give you

Ant Pruitt (02:08:50):
Your credit. That's, but I gotta show you where this mule kicked me on the back of my arm here.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:08:54):
<Laugh>. Oh yeah. Don't even

Leo Laporte (02:08:56):
<Laugh>.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:08:57):
Gosh, if my arms look like that, none of my clothes would fit.

Leo Laporte (02:09:00):
You don't wanna look like that. That's

Ant Pruitt (02:09:01):
Mr. Howell brought this in. I didn't get to go to the gym this morning, so I brought my dumbbell in so I could do some stuff in the office. I thought

Leo Laporte (02:09:07):
I your

Ant Pruitt (02:09:08):
Dumbbell office and apparently Mr. Hall, Mr. How thought it was quite amusing and brought it into the office.

Leo Laporte (02:09:13):
Stacey, what's thing, <laugh>. Let's see if Jeff can even pick it off. What do I do with it then? It's only shoulder

Ant Pruitt (02:09:19):
Press.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:09:20):
What do I do with it then? Shoulder

Ant Pruitt (02:09:21):
Press can do some rose. Oh, wait's

Leo Laporte (02:09:25):
Five curls. Five kilograms. Yes. It's only 20.

Ant Pruitt (02:09:27):
She was about 20. Yeah,

Leo Laporte (02:09:28):
I thought it was pounds. <Laugh> pounds too week. Sorry.

Ant Pruitt (02:09:33):
Miss Stacy

Leo Laporte (02:09:34):
Ahead, miss Stacy. Ouch. That's

Stacey Higginbotham (02:09:35):
Alright, man. So I got the weighted vest. I thought I told you about this, but they said I did.

Leo Laporte (02:09:40):
Wait a minute. I'm about, wait. Weighty vest. Is that like you give dogs so that they don't get scared in thunderstorms?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:09:46):
Yes. It's like a comfort thing. Sure. <laugh>. It is. So I got it because I was worried about osteoporosis and I got it back in April.

Leo Laporte (02:09:55):
It'll make you look like you have osteoporosis. <Laugh> hunched over. We're gonna carry the weight. I'm so tired. I How heavy is your weighted vest?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:10:05):
So mine goes to 20 pounds and I, I'm doing the full 20 pounds. But, so the idea here, there's a couple

Leo Laporte (02:10:11):
Ideas. You know, my trick was just to eat more bagels and I carry an extra 20 pounds around with me all the time. All the time. That's hard

Stacey Higginbotham (02:10:19):
On your knees,

Leo Laporte (02:10:19):
Man. It is. Trust me.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:10:21):
So I got it for walking. Other people will wear a weighted vest for pushups and fitness. Things like pull-ups. I'm sure ant would rock a vest and, but

Ant Pruitt (02:10:33):
College hard hit, college hard hit has a weighted vest for his track training.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:10:38):
Wow. Right? Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. So I, mine is not for that. Although I do now do lunges and squats where I,

Ant Pruitt (02:10:43):
I want a model's model. I want you to model it and demonstrate it.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:10:47):
Do you really? I can go grab it. Yeah. Who's mean?

Ant Pruitt (02:10:49):
This is an audio show. Who

Leo Laporte (02:10:50):
Do you, do you recommend a manufacturer or does it matter?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:10:53):
So because I just started and because I knew I was only using it for walking, I wanted to get one from Dick's Sporting Goods. 'cause They have some nice ones, but the one I wanted, they don't have. Oh. So I just got one. I got one for like 50 bucks on Amazon. Yeah, because I see they could be perfectly for,

Leo Laporte (02:11:12):
They could be as much as $200. They could be

Stacey Higginbotham (02:11:14):
Expensive. Yeah. So if you're gonna do So stitching, so like the hype. It's the hype. Yeah. There, there is there. The expensive ones are worth it. If you're gonna, you want it to be super form fitting so you don't injure yourself or fling things around. Especially if you're working

Leo Laporte (02:11:27):
And you like

Stacey Higginbotham (02:11:28):
Rest, because that's not gonna be pleasant. Right. but the, the big things to look out for are you don't wanna start with more than 10% of your weight for anything really.

Leo Laporte (02:11:40):
And well, that's easy. That's gives me 50 pounds. Easy <laugh>. That's good. Alright.

Ant Pruitt (02:11:44):
Most that <laugh>. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:11:47):
And look for something that is form fitting enough and that I look for things that neoprene ones are very popular. I hate them because you can't really wash them really well. Oh yeah. It's great. And look for removable weights. Yeah. Yeah. Look for removable things. So you can take it removable weights so you can change the weight. And also, so you can take those out and run your vest through the wash. Right. so mine is like move star. I bought it in Amazon. Okay.

Leo Laporte (02:12:13):
They have a lot of them. And you're right, the price ranges everywhere from 20 bucks to a hundred bucks. Yeah. So the all over the

Stacey Higginbotham (02:12:20):
Place, the things to look at are, yeah. Adjust. Like being able to take out your weights so you can also adjust them. Look for, I look for the weights to at a higher end one, they're gonna be metal plates lower and they're gonna be like sand or little filling. Can

Leo Laporte (02:12:35):
I get one that says police on it? That would be good

Stacey Higginbotham (02:12:40):
Actually. I'm sure you could Sure. That's what I look like when I'm walking around. I know. I look like some sort of crazy

Leo Laporte (02:12:45):
Person. Nobody gonna mess with you. Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:12:48):
But I love it. It's like I have, I won't have a bone density test for another year, but the reason I got it is because it helps

Leo Laporte (02:12:58):
You're smart.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:12:59):
Your spine in your hips Smart. Yeah. For women who are in danger of osteoporosis. Yep. And you know what, it also boosts your heart rate on a walk and walks are like mm-hmm. <Affirmative>,

Ant Pruitt (02:13:08):
Burn burns. Some calories mean you just,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:13:10):
Yeah. You just pop this on. It's not like super intense and you just go for a walk. I walk the dog with it. When the dog stops, I like hop up and down, you know? Or I do the lunches. <Laugh>.

Ant Pruitt (02:13:20):
Oh, wait, wait, wait, wait. Yeah, I definitely wanna, we gotta, we need to make that a g. Yeah. Yeah. What was that? Just now? Just but under, under down. I mean,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:13:29):
Well, I can't, can't jump. It's like jump rope, do little hops. This is, and then, yeah.

Leo Laporte (02:13:35):
I'm just getting exhausted hearing that <laugh> so exhausting.

Ant Pruitt (02:13:40):
Meanwhile, I look over here to the left and someone's pointing. I want

Leo Laporte (02:13:43):
One. Oh, clean through it. Watch. It's

Stacey Higginbotham (02:13:46):
Great. I mean it's really, it's really helpful. And you can start small and load up and it doesn't feel like you're working out, but you are actually. I mean, my heart rate when I walk with this is regularly getting up to like 115 beats per minute without stressing me out. And I can walk for an hour with this and I'm like crazy. Or half an hour, whatever.

Leo Laporte (02:14:07):
Queen Pro has a microphone. Let us be known. She can speak for herself. Oh, they gave her a mic. Wow.

Ant Pruitt (02:14:12):
Boy, we're in trouble.

Phoebe Pruitt (02:14:13):
Yes. I was diagnosed with the O osteopenia.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:14:20):
Yes. This is perfect for that.

Phoebe Pruitt (02:14:22):
Thank you. That's why I said I want one because I have Oh.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:14:26):
But start

Phoebe Pruitt (02:14:27):
The beginnings of that in my lower back for whatever reason.

Leo Laporte (02:14:32):
So, yeah. So it's lifting weights, that's bone density, right? Yeah.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:14:37):
But it's really important you start don't go too heavy too fast. 'cause Wouldn't do that. Okay. I just, I, I'm like, I don't know if you know,

Leo Laporte (02:14:45):
So you're not gonna recommend a brand, but, but you, but those are things to look for. Removable weights, washable. Yes. Yeah. Good idea. I think for everybody. Yeah. And

Stacey Higginbotham (02:14:56):
The right size. Yeah. Yeah. Form fitting if you're, and high quality stitching. Although if you're paying 50 bucks, you can get rid of it. Yeah.

Leo Laporte (02:15:06):
I And if you go ahead.

Stacey Higginbotham (02:15:09):
Oh, I was like, and if you wanna go like real heavy Yeah. They have plates, but I oof.

Ant Pruitt (02:15:14):
I didn't, I don't recommend those.

Leo Laporte (02:15:15):
No, that's that's fine. Yeah. That

Stacey Higginbotham (02:15:17):
Looked like I don't awful.

Ant Pruitt (02:15:17):
Those. No, just get a, if you wanna get plates, just get a dag gum sled and drag that

Leo Laporte (02:15:22):
<Laugh>. I

Ant Pruitt (02:15:24):
Mean, 'cause that's, that's more, that's heavier weight. I'm dead serious. If you wanna put that much weight on, get a sled and drag that, you'll do much more work.

Leo Laporte (02:15:31):
I see that at the gym. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. That was hard. Good pick. Thank you. Stacy was was hard. Well, here's my pick. You think? No, I'm pretty fitness focused. I, I recommend these dumbbells. They weigh 0.01 kilograms. They

Ant Pruitt (02:15:47):
Are

Leo Laporte (02:15:48):
Massive. They're, they're not, they're light, but you do a lot of wraps. Pink. I do a lot. Well, you can get 'em in other colors. I like pink. No, pink is good. Pick is good. Just two pieces. $3 and 92 cents <laugh>. One 10th of Okay. My child.

Ant Pruitt (02:16:02):
Gram finger per finger. Pearls. My

Leo Laporte (02:16:03):
Child

Stacey Higginbotham (02:16:03):
Was rocking. The little two we got, we got when they were a kid. We got the little two pound weights for them to practice

Leo Laporte (02:16:10):
With. Yeah. Yeah. That's I think a good idea. You don't need,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:16:12):
You don't need to give a kid plastic. Doug. Give them a little two pound

Leo Laporte (02:16:16):
Weights. Give a nice ones.

Ant Pruitt (02:16:18):
That's hilarious. Dude.

Leo Laporte (02:16:20):
<Laugh>, I'm just teasing. Obviously Mr. Jeff Jarvis. So what is we all pick? So I think I'll go since you're going to

Jeff Jarvis (02:16:28):
See Oppenheimer

Leo Laporte (02:16:31):
In a couple of weeks. Yeah. A week from Friday. Yeah.

Jeff Jarvis (02:16:33):
Right up against smack up against the screen. Yep. Yep. <Laugh>.

Leo Laporte (02:16:37):
That's all I could get. I thought it was fourth row from the back. 'cause Fourth row from the front <laugh>. Oh, I should bring my I don't know what I don't know.

Jeff Jarvis (02:16:47):
Finger Geiger counter is what you bring. Yeah.

Ant Pruitt (02:16:49):
It's gonna be looking straight up at the movie. So

Jeff Jarvis (02:16:51):
There's a, there's a neat little story here in ours, Technica that says that the IMAX control panel, we see a lot of pictures of the, of the plates. Plates that are bigger. Yeah. It emulates a palm pilot software.

Leo Laporte (02:17:02):
This is, this technology is so ancient and people learn this 'cause of a TikTok. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>, they saw this TikTok of the IMAX platter and somebody said, what's that on the iPad? It looks like a palm pilot. And they actually wrote a palm pilot emulator because it was originally Palm pilot software. Amazing. That controlled these giant, I there's only a, you know, half dozen or dozen of these theaters in that country that can play this 70 millimeter print. Isn't that hysterical? That's amazing. Yeah. As

Jeff Jarvis (02:17:33):
I said here in the story of it ain't broke.

Leo Laporte (02:17:36):
Right. And we, you know, we see this all the time. School districts that are still using a migas to control their

Ant Pruitt (02:17:42):
HVAC <laugh>

Leo Laporte (02:17:43):
Air traffic controllers that are using Altair. Well, that's

Jeff Jarvis (02:17:45):
A different

Leo Laporte (02:17:46):
Matter. <Laugh>. wow. Atc you know, I wonder if I could get in we're gonna see this at a 70 millimeter imax. I wonder if I could Oh, beg to go in and see. Oh, that'd be fun. The thing, it, it's such a long movie. 600 pounds of film, 11 miles Long because it's a three hour movie and they didn't plan for 'em to be that long. They didn't get special platters made. How do

Jeff Jarvis (02:18:10):
They lift it into place?

Leo Laporte (02:18:11):
They use it for the very carefully, the forklift. Jeez. Literally a forklift.

Ant Pruitt (02:18:16):
Very carefully.

Leo Laporte (02:18:19):
Good number heavy man. Yes. What is your pick of the Aunt Pruitt?

Ant Pruitt (02:18:25):
My pick is Google Stadia is living on in the Pruitt household.

Leo Laporte (02:18:31):
What?

Ant Pruitt (02:18:32):
Yes, because I finally found open E M U

Leo Laporte (02:18:37):
Oh

Ant Pruitt (02:18:37):
Yeah. I guess that's how you say it. Yep. for Mac. And I can now use my Google Stadia controller. That was, that was killed by Google however long ago via Bluetooth to play some classic n e s and PlayStation games. And it's been quite enjoyable.

Leo Laporte (02:18:53):
It's a game emulator.

Ant Pruitt (02:18:54):
Yes. Game emulator on on Mac Os. 'cause I was trying dystopia couldn't get it to work. And I was trying some other U s b connected game controllers. I tried maybe two other ones. Couldn't, couldn't get it to work. But it works. I don't, I don't know why, but the Google's stad, that's stern controller works like a champ. So.

Leo Laporte (02:19:16):
Yeah. And what games are, is it you or the hardhead?

Ant Pruitt (02:19:18):
Oh, this is me. Are you, what

Leo Laporte (02:19:20):
Games you

Ant Pruitt (02:19:20):
Playing? They get their own stuff. This is for me <laugh>. I've been playing Contra and Metro and Mike Tyson's punch out Super Mario Brothers.

Leo Laporte (02:19:28):
Oh my goodness. Oh,

Ant Pruitt (02:19:29):
It's been great. It's

Leo Laporte (02:19:30):
Been great. There is a an an Atari game collection for Xbox that doesn't just have the games. It has documentaries. What and so you can play the games, but you can also play the you can watch the shows, the, you know, the little doc mini documentaries. Oh man. I think there's a hundred, a hundred games or something like that.

Ant Pruitt (02:19:52):
The 2,600 was great.

Leo Laporte (02:19:54):
That was my first thing, right? It's my

Ant Pruitt (02:19:57):
First, oh

Leo Laporte (02:19:58):
My gosh. First game machine

Ant Pruitt (02:20:00):
Pitfall on under

Leo Laporte (02:20:01):
Pitfall 600. Oh

Ant Pruitt (02:20:03):
Man.

Leo Laporte (02:20:03):
Yeah, it's the best. It's actually, it's only 50. It's Atari 50. It's called, it's to celebrate the 50th anniversary. Okay. This, this review calls it weaponized nostalgia. And this is

Ant Pruitt (02:20:15):
On Xbox.

Leo Laporte (02:20:16):
Xbox or PlayStation.

Ant Pruitt (02:20:17):
Okay.

Leo Laporte (02:20:19):
Remember that? Yes.

Ant Pruitt (02:20:19):
Yeah man, that was great. Yep.

Leo Laporte (02:20:22):
There's Pong. I was a big fan of Space Wars

Ant Pruitt (02:20:27):
Raid. I used to like missile attack.

Leo Laporte (02:20:29):
Yeah. Missile attack.

Ant Pruitt (02:20:31):
Gosh. That's

Leo Laporte (02:20:32):
Good stuff. Kids, we've come to the end of this episode. I wanna get a short one in. It's only two hours because we wanna give you time only two. And then we'll go to dinner. We too,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:20:42):
We talk for 45 minutes.

Leo Laporte (02:20:44):
It felt like we did. God,

Stacey Higginbotham (02:20:46):
I meant like but for 45 minutes before we even started the show

Leo Laporte (02:20:50):
We did. Yeah. Hard to believe.

Jeff Jarvis (02:20:52):
'Cause We have such fun

Leo Laporte (02:20:53):
Together's. 'cause We love talking to each other. Yes, we do. Yeah. Stacey Agen Bathum is@staceyoniot.com. That's where you can find the IOT podcast she does with Kevin Tofl articles about iot. There's also events. There's a whole lot of stuff. This is a great site and you must subscribe to Stacy's free weekly Internet of Things newsletter anything. What's going on in the podcast? Last time we talked you had that, that person on with the cyber trust, right?

Stacey Higginbotham (02:21:25):
Oh yeah. Who sounded like Mr. Rogers? I love him. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. <Laugh> tomorrow's guest is the c e O of Purple Air. And we're talking about citizen science. How to get the most out of your purple

Leo Laporte (02:21:35):
Air. I have an indoor and outdoor purple. Yeah. From back when the wildfires were

Ant Pruitt (02:21:40):
There we're filters now.

Leo Laporte (02:21:42):
No, the purple just senses and tells you. Oh, okay. Stop breathing 'cause it's

Stacey Higginbotham (02:21:46):
Bad out. Stop breathing. Yeah. Don't go outside

Leo Laporte (02:21:49):
Bad out there. Very nice. Stacey on iot.com.

Jeff Jarvis (02:21:52):
It looks like Ms. Pruitt is

Leo Laporte (02:21:55):
Ready to sing.

Ant Pruitt (02:21:56):
Yeah, I don't

Leo Laporte (02:21:56):
Know about that. Wait a minute now. Yeah. Hold on. Hold, hold on. Before we do that, Jeff Jarvis, make sure you get the book, the Gutenberg parenthesis. Everybody should buy it. Gutenberg parenthesis. And

Ant Pruitt (02:22:08):
Hopefully you'll sign mine before Kong.

Jeff Jarvis (02:22:09):
It is actually, this is bad news. Good news. It is outta stock, but temporarily there's a new press run. It'll be in stock. Yay.

Leo Laporte (02:22:15):
Good for you. On next week. That's good. You sold out the first edition. Good for you. I have a first edition. Oh, this might be worth something. Someday. <laugh>, you'll find also@buzzmachine.com. About $4 and

Ant Pruitt (02:22:27):
It's about the same amount as that picture we got. <Laugh>. Yeah,

Leo Laporte (02:22:30):
Exactly. Jeff's also the director of the Town Night Center for Entrepreneurial Journalism. Oh, I should get you to autograph those pictures. Yes. <laugh>. You don't wanna Newmar artifact of journalism at the City University. Newbar of New York. Gotta get Craig's plugin. Jeff. So great to see you. Thank you. Good to see you for coming out here. Aunt Pruitt, of course, in our community in the Discord and also online@auntpruitt.com slash Prince. And here every Wednesday. Thank you Ant mm-hmm. <Affirmative>. We do this week in Google. Every Wednesday led, let's see, 2:00 PM Pacific, 5:00 PM Eastern, 2100 utc. You can watch us live at Live Twit tv. If you're watching live chat, live in our I R C or of course you can join our club twit and get into that discord right behind the V of rope there. That's where all the good stuff happens. So excited about this September interview. Mm. Or, or a m a or fireside chat with Hugh Howie

Ant Pruitt (02:23:26):
Chat.

Leo Laporte (02:23:26):
Yeah. Who did the wool series that silos based on and our good friend Daniel Suarez, freedom Team Demon Tmm his newest book. He's just great.

Ant Pruitt (02:23:36):
It's gonna be great. I'm really looking forward to that. And you're gonna join us for that as well. I

Leo Laporte (02:23:39):
Will join you and we're gonna stream that for everybody to see. Mm-Hmm. <affirmative>. But if you want to see it after the fact, you'll have to be be

Ant Pruitt (02:23:46):
Member.

Leo Laporte (02:23:47):
Go to twit tv slash club. Join. That's just one of many events. We have almost as many events as a Commonwealth Club now. Yeah. We we're really putting, we're putting on a show and it does support us. You also get ad free versions of all the shows. Seven bucks a month. It's, it's really a good deal. Please join the Cool KLI Kids Club. And

Ant Pruitt (02:24:04):
I want to, I wanna give one more shout out about an upcoming event. We have our coffee time photo critique that'll be coming up in a couple of weeks based on some market research. Apparently my coffee time has been just a bit too distinct. So how about we just have you all upload whatever photo that you that was inspired to capture. It

Leo Laporte (02:24:27):
Says right here, best fits the theme of coffee time. What people don't read. That's what,

Ant Pruitt (02:24:31):
What I said. So we are just going to, if tea time,

Leo Laporte (02:24:34):
You could feel

Ant Pruitt (02:24:35):
Inspired to snap a photo. I want you to upload it and let us know why you were inspired to snap that photo. But you will be critiqued on that chapter. And

Leo Laporte (02:24:43):
No AI generated images and no AI must be real

Ant Pruitt (02:24:46):
Photos. Not this time. No ai.

Leo Laporte (02:24:48):
That'll be fun. That's, that's coming up August 4th at 4:00 PM One of many, many events. Going on seven bucks a month is nothing to pay

Ant Pruitt (02:24:56):
For this good stuff. No. Pay more for coffee. I

Leo Laporte (02:24:58):
Think so. Alright. The Queen has consented to perform <laugh>. What will we be what will be here? This is kind of America's Got Talent. No Twitter edition.

Ant Pruitt (02:25:12):
It's

Leo Laporte (02:25:13):
Not that I don't have a button or a chair to wait a minute. I'll start facing the wrong way. And if I like it, I'll spin around. How about <laugh>? What, what are you gonna be singing for us? I'm a little

Ant Pruitt (02:25:22):
Nervous. It's

Phoebe Pruitt (02:25:23):
Just the intro to the,

Phoebe Pruitt (02:25:24):
The SpongeBob. My first song. Just a little bit of it. Not the whole thing or anything like that, you

Leo Laporte (02:25:29):
Know, ladies and gentlemen. All right. The mic up The queen. What You wanna introduce your aunt? You know her better than anybody.

Phoebe Pruitt (02:25:37):
I'll just start it. Just start

Leo Laporte (02:25:38):
Singing. She won't want, I gotta, I'm gonna turn. I like it. I'll be back. What's the mic

Phoebe Pruitt (02:25:47):
G Golly, that was close. Is just a little smoke. A minor set back. A few more hours at most. And I'll be done with this here. Brand new jet pack <laugh>. And then this Texas squirrel. This country girl will spread her wings and fly my bushy tail of comics. Trail clear across the sky above the town, and looking down on a typical bikini bottom day.

Leo Laporte (02:26:16):
<Laugh>. Oh boy. Straight out of town. The music. That's it for Twig. We'll see you next time. Bye-Bye. That's, that's a showing. That was awesome. Okay. We did every week. Sound great. Every week. It sounded the same. Great. That was awesome. Oh, oh my gosh. I had no idea. That's really good. Stacey, you got to literally end on a high note. Yeah. Yeah. She seems You got to end on a high note. Stacey enjoyed it too.

Scott Wilkinson (02:26:44):
Hey there. Scott Wilkinson here in case you hadn't heard. Home Theater Geeks is Back. Each week I bring you the latest audio, video news, tips and tricks to get the most out of your AV system product reviews and more you can enjoy Home Theater Geeks only if you're a member of Club Twi, which costs seven bucks a month. Or you can subscribe to Home Theater Geeks by itself for only 2 99 a month. I hope you'll join me for a weekly dose of home theater Geekitude